.410 as a home defense shotgun

[Ecchymosis]

Personally I think people take home defense calibers far too seriously.

I personally don't think that possible loss of my or my loved ones' lives can ever be taken too seriously. Now I am not saying you need a howitzer to defend your family, but I personally would like something that will reliably defend my family in my home and prevent a BG from reaching my family. 410 just doesn't seem to fit the bill in this department. Sure its better than nothing, but there are other options that are inexpensive and readily available.

That being said, I have a remington 870 wingmaster 12ga [A great shotgun that I got with an 18" barrel for 220 dollars] (20ga is also acceptable) and that is my self defense gun for my household (my G19 is only used in case I need to fight towards my shotgun (its a 5' fight :P ). My entire family knows how to use it and they have all be trained with it so they don't freak out (as much) in the case of an intruder attacking them.

I am sure your dad had nerves of steel and could shoot someone in the eye with his 22 in the dark right after he had awoken from a deep sleep and that adrenaline had no effect on his aim whatsoever but I am sure he would have been doing his family a great service to arm himself with a 10/12/16/20 gauge shotgun loaded with 00/0/1 buck shot as not to have to worry as much about shooting an intruder in the eyeball with a 22 IN THE DARK WITH ADRENALINE... you get my point.

Let me put it this way:
Sure, you could use a bunch of tied up bed sheets to escape your burning house, but wouldn't you much rather have an escape plan along with a sturdy set of fire stairs/rope ladder to get out quickly and effectively?

[lcfarrelljr@yahoo.com]

"Now, 3-5 .36cal balls of about 70-85gr a piece with little mass will have little energy per ball, and will lose their energy very quick due to the lack of mass. Try to stop a single 240gr slug."

Actually multiple hits provide an increase in perceived energy, and damage, to the body being injured. That's why the use of "The Hammer" is, by many shooting schools. highly recommended; 2 hits in the target have the effect of three. A 3" .410 Magnum shell holds 5 (ea.) 000 balls totaling 350 grains in weight, which weight is much greater than that of a 240 grain .44 Magnum bullet. Also, the reduced velocity of the shotgun balls greatly reduce the chance of over penetration, ensuring that all 350 grains @ 1100 fps worth of energy remain within the target body. Because of it's well documented over penetration, the .44 Magnum has been proven, on humans, to be a less effective stopper than other "less powerful" cartridges.

As far as one person's preference for a greater amount of pellets in the shot charge being beneficial, at room cleaning ranges, the shot charge of a 12 ga. is so narrow in width as to mandate the necessity for proper aiming of that shot charge. It is, with unaimed fire at, say, 15-20 feet, fairly difficult to place all pellets from a 12 ga. buckshot load on target.

If you have to aim a shotgun, and you do, aiming at, and hitting with 5 (ea.) 000 Buck at 1100 fps, a humanoid target will ensure that that humanoid target ceases forward aggressive movement, because the effect of 5 hits is, to the central nervous system, so pronounced.

Couple that with the lower blast, flash and recoil of the .410 ga. shotgun, and you, compared to the 12 ga., have a much easier to use weapon system.

Will a 12 ga. work? Yes. Is a 12 ga. necessary for home defense, at home defense situation ranges?

No.

Larry

[offshorebear]

If you feel comfortable that you can make head shots at 3 in the morning, then that's fine. .22 head shots are probably extremely lethal as well. I know I can't reliably make head shots.

410 slugs are probably very effective against the center of mass. .410 buck might not be as effective and to me only offers disadvantages to the slugs but I still wouldn't want to be the one to test this.

Any round that offers sufficient penetration to stop a threat will also sail through walls. That's one reason 45 is my first go to round in home defense, it looses energy quicker than say 300 win mag.

[offshorebear]

I didn't know they had special ammo designed for the judge on the market. It looks like they did good with the old .410 bore and loaded it up to .45LC area.

http://www.federalpremium.com/produc...ll.aspx?id=847

It still isn't my first choice, I would prefer a fancy bonded hollow point loaded to .45 Colt specs for the Judge. I'm sure jammed into the belly the bad guy won't be able to tell the difference though.

Here's some testing of the judge with regular .410 loads, it would be interesting to see the specific judge loads.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot41.htm

[normanvin]

The golden bear two and three quarter with 5 pellets, made in Russia has a whole lot more kick than the american ammo. It also holds a tight pattern at 25 to 30 feet, all five pellets were in about a 10 inch circle. Oh yes, I don't plan to let anybody get close enough to me to be able to put a gun in thier belly. What I really want in home defence is to be able to hit two people with one shot while still half asleep. If I can do this I will most likely have some kind of a chance to prevail. The # 4 buck at seven or so feet will hit two people standing next to each other. Very seldom is thier just one person.

I don't know what you are basing the section I have put into bold. But ok I also doubt the two of them will be standing next to each other to shoot both at the same time.

[normanvin]

The last time I got shot the two parolees were standing next to each other at my front door. If I had had a judge I might have prevailed, instead I was pronounced DOA and spent 13 days in ICU.

So you recovered from being dead?

[LowCapacity]

<The troll that was stirring things up in this thread is long gone. Nothing to see here...>

[LowCapacity]

You certainly have given your self the right handle Low Capacity. I am not sure what you are talking about but I will never forget the the two ex cons that tried to rob and kill me. The idiot information I spit out comes off sites that boast of their expertize on ballistics and all the gun tomfoolery that one could ever want to read. Your macho daydream fantasies are very exciting but mostly myth. You are most likely an OK guy but just a little short on manners and maturity. I might add that your sense of humor needs some working on.

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH You got your information from THE INTERNET!!!! Of course, why would anyone need any real world experience when you can wake up at the crack of noon and just read what some self-proclaimed expert on the interwebs tells you. I suppose you type with a Taurus Judge in each hand too.

[Charlie B]

I hate to be so harsh on a new member but you're obviously a fucking idiot.

That’s a classic, LMFAO – Added Rep

[Cbarnes]

Ok if you think 12 gauge is the way to go I say try one thing. Take all your clothes off and turn off all the lights. The remove your ear protection, because for home defense situation you would be firing this gun in this condition. Then inside a closed space pull off one round! What happens next is you are deaf and blind!!

A 410 in close closed situations could not only be a good option but could be a better option. A 12 gauge inside a closed space will make your ears bleed with no ear protection. A 410 not so much...