Rules for transporting firearms to a gun range w/o LTCP?

[sl315]

I'm a PA resident but do not have a LTCP. What are the rules for transporting firearms to and from a gun club/range within PA?

[firebird.77]

Loaded magazines must be in a separate container or compartment from the weapon. This means with a "tactical" soft case for an AR-15 style rifle you can have loaded mags on the outside pouches but not directly with the rifle.



No stops in between range and house...direct travel only.

[P89]

The Law.
18 U.S.C. § 926A

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.


More laws can be found here.
http://reference.pafoa.org/statutes/

[Swarner793]

The Law.
18 U.S.C. § 926A

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.

This is Federal Statute regarding interstate transportation. I think PA law is more directly applicable:

(8) Any person while carrying a firearm which is not loaded and is in a secure wrapper from the place of purchase to his home or place of business, or to a place of repair, sale or appraisal or back to his home or place of business, or in moving from one place of abode or business to another or from his home to a vacation or recreational home or dwelling or back, or to recover stolen property under section 6111.1(b)(4) (relating to Pennsylvania State Police), or to a place of instruction intended to teach the safe handling, use or maintenance of firearms or back or to a location to which the person has been directed to relinquish firearms under 23 Pa.C.S. § 6108 (relating to relief) or back upon return of the relinquished firearm or to a licensed dealer's place of business for relinquishment pursuant to 23 Pa.C.S § 6108.2 (relating to relinquishment for consignment sale, lawful transfer or safekeeping) or back upon return of the relinquished firearm or to a location for safekeeping pursuant to 23 Pa.C.S. § 6108.3 (relating to relinquishment to third party for safekeeping) or back upon return of the relinquished firearm.

Be safe (and shoot local).

Scott

[tl_3237]

Swarmer 793 incorrectly cites 18 Pa CS 6106(b)(8). The correct statute (exception) is 18 Pa CS 6106(b)(4) which reads:

(4) Any persons engaged in target shooting with a firearm, if such persons are at or are going to or from their places of assembly or target practice and if, while going to or from their places of assembly or target practice, the firearm is not loaded.

Swarmer 793 is correct that the 18 USC 926A only involves INTERstate transportation through other states and is inapplicable to INTRAstate transport.

Finally, the technical definition of "loaded" for Pa purposes is given by:

18 Pa CS 6102 -
"Loaded." A firearm is loaded if the firing chamber, the nondetachable magazine or, in the case of a revolver, any of the chambers of the cylinder contain ammunition capable of being fired. In the case of a firearm which utilizes a detachable magazine, the term shall mean a magazine suitable for use in said firearm which magazine contains such ammunition and has been inserted in the firearm or is in the same container or, where the container has multiple compartments, the same compartment thereof as the firearm. If the magazine is inserted into a pouch, holder, holster or other protective device that provides for a complete and secure enclosure of the ammunition, then the pouch, holder, holster or other protective device shall be deemed to be a separate compartment.

[P89]

This is Federal Statute regarding interstate transportation. I think PA law is more directly applicable:

(8) Any person while carrying a firearm which is not loaded and is in a secure wrapper from the place of purchase to his home or place of business, or to a place of repair, sale or appraisal or back to his home or place of business, or in moving from one place of abode or business to another or from his home to a vacation or recreational home or dwelling or back, or to recover stolen property under section 6111.1(b)(4) (relating to Pennsylvania State Police), or to a place of instruction intended to teach the safe handling, use or maintenance of firearms or back or to a location to which the person has been directed to relinquish firearms under 23 Pa.C.S. § 6108 (relating to relief) or back upon return of the relinquished firearm or to a licensed dealer's place of business for relinquishment pursuant to 23 Pa.C.S § 6108.2 (relating to relinquishment for consignment sale, lawful transfer or safekeeping) or back upon return of the relinquished firearm or to a location for safekeeping pursuant to 23 Pa.C.S. § 6108.3 (relating to relinquishment to third party for safekeeping) or back upon return of the relinquished firearm.

Be safe (and shoot local).

Scott

That is one terribly written law. I had to read it twice.
...and "secure wrapper"...wtf does that mean? Saran wrap...Foil...Duct tape?

[Delkal]

18 Pa CS 6102 -
"Loaded." A firearm is loaded if the firing chamber, the nondetachable magazine or, in the case of a revolver, any of the chambers of the cylinder contain ammunition capable of being fired. In the case of a firearm which utilizes a detachable magazine, the term shall mean a magazine suitable for use in said firearm which magazine contains such ammunition and has been inserted in the firearm or is in the same container or, where the container has multiple compartments, the same compartment thereof as the firearm. If the magazine is inserted into a pouch, holder, holster or other protective device that provides for a complete and secure enclosure of the ammunition, then the pouch, holder, holster or other protective device shall be deemed to be a separate compartment.


So If I get this right.....I can have in my range bag (one compartment), a large bag of ammo, an unloaded magazine and a pistol and I am OK. BUT if I had ONE loose round in the bottom of my range bag I would be in violation (same compartment).

Or how about this.......I have a loaded magazine in a ziplock bag (a separate pouch). I have it in the same paper bag as my pistol (and my beer) and I am walking (OK...stumbling) to the nearest range. I should be OK

[tl_3237]

18 Pa CS 6102 -
"Loaded." A firearm is loaded if the firing chamber, the nondetachable magazine or, in the case of a revolver, any of the chambers of the cylinder contain ammunition capable of being fired. In the case of a firearm which utilizes a detachable magazine, the term shall mean a magazine suitable for use in said firearm which magazine contains such ammunition and has been inserted in the firearm or is in the same container or, where the container has multiple compartments, the same compartment thereof as the firearm. If the magazine is inserted into a pouch, holder, holster or other protective device that provides for a complete and secure enclosure of the ammunition, then the pouch, holder, holster or other protective device shall be deemed to be a separate compartment.


So If I get this right.....I can have in my range bag (one compartment), a large bag of ammo, an unloaded magazine and a pistol and I am OK. BUT if I had ONE loose round in the bottom of my range bag I would be in violation (same compartment).
Or how about this.......I have a loaded magazine in a ziplock bag (a separate pouch). I have it in the same paper bag as my pistol (and my beer) and I am walking (OK...stumbling) to the nearest range. I should be OK

Not if that "ONE loose round" was truly loose and not in a magazine.

[thaghost87]

Forgive me for my ignorance, but i don't quite understand this rule/law for transporting.to abd from the range. I usually have my gun unloaded in the factory case in the trunk and my ammo in my glove box. Is that an improper way?

Also another member just posted a nice secure locking hand gun safe ( see HERE)
That i want to get to keep my gun locked in, under the seat seperate from ammo when going to the range. Is this idea illegal?

[tl_3237]

Forgive me for my ignorance, but i don't quite understand this rule/law for transporting.to abd from the range. I usually have my gun unloaded in the factory case in the trunk and my ammo in my glove box. Is that an improper way?

Also another member just posted a nice secure locking hand gun safe ( see HERE)
That i want to get to keep my gun locked in, under the seat seperate from ammo when going to the range. Is this idea illegal?

What you're doing is fine. Actually the only requirement is that the firearm be "unloaded'. The definition for that derives from the 6102 definition of "loaded" I previously posted.

When going to/from a range while in Pa the UNLOADED firearm can be anywhere in the vehicle including "on your person" It need not be locked in any manner of container though, personally, I would suggest in the trunk to avoid potential hassles if stopped by police for whatever reasons.