Pistol transfer quandary

[groundondown]

I have a bit of a quandary which I was hoping someone might have some insight on.
I recently came into possession of a .380 handgun, which was purchased for me by my brother. He apparently thought in my line of work and where I live, I needed protection.
However, he purchased it in a private sale with another person, without the pistol being transferred to his possession through FFL. Apparently the person who previously owned it now has children getting to the age they get into things and wanted it out of the house. And he has since (two days after giving it to me) moved to Texas. He was not aware of the handgun transfer laws in the state.
But I work closely with the legal system, and researched it a bit, found out about the transfer process and really don't want to carry it without it being legal, having seen the consequences of doing so.
I have attempted to contact the original owner so that it could be transferred legally to my possession, but that has proved fruitless, as that person also lives a good distance from where I now reside, but still in PA.
Aside from carrying an illegal handgun, which I do not plan to do, what options do I have?
Can I go to a gun shop without the original owner's information, they can run the serial, make sure it is not stolen and then transfer it to me?
I am lost at this point and any suggestions would be welcome.

edit: I should also mention that I do have my carry license and am legally allowed to possess a firearm, I just never had the desire to get a weapon until one was given to me, but got the carry license because I could.

[knight0334]

It is the duty of the seller to have the gun properly transferred. There is no penalty for the buyer(nor really the seller either).

If you want to make things as legal as they can be, you can take the gun to a FFL and have it transferred from yourself, to yourself. Some dealers(FFL) will do this, some will not.

The FFL doesn't run the serial number, nor can they run the serial to see if it is stolen. And the PSP is more concerned with who the gun is going to. It is possible when the PSP makes the new entry that they make check NCIC to see if it was reported stolen, then you might have problems.

[CartBone69]

Or since your brother is the one who actually bought it for you go to the FFL and have them transfer it from him to you, they might be more willing to do that. Even though i knew the law when i turned 21 i still had my mom transfer the 9mm that she had bought and gave to me when i was 18 just so there was paper work. I really didnt know what a good choice i made in doing that since i joined this forum and see the trouble that some of the people have.

[tonyfac]

As long as you can pass the background check, there is nothing from preventing you from either: you to you or brother to you. (as mentioned above)

[Chazman321]

I will also vote for brother to you. They aren't going to ask him where it came from. He walks in and says he wants to transfer it to you because it's a gift that he bought awhile ago and wants to give to you. They charge you some money, make you fill out 2 papers, call in a background check, and you walk out the door. Done and over, will take you maybe 15 minutes, 20 tops... Most places charge 20-30 bucks to do a transfer. So for a little amount of money, you legally own it.

Once a gun enters a bound book at an FFL, which is what you're doing, it becomes the property of that person or the FFL. A guy I know had some guns stolen from his house. Filed a police report, and found the guns. Called the police and had them meet him at the gun shop. Showed the police report to the officers with the make, model, and serial number. The guy told him he could have them back for what he paid for them, around 700 bucks if I recall correctly. He said no, they're his and he bought stolen weapons, they should be returned to him. The police said the gun shop was right. I believe the ATF sided with him as well...


-Chaz

[truecrimson]

Snip......... And he has since (two days after giving it to me) moved to Texas. ...snip

If I understand him correctly, his brother is not available to transfer it to him at this point.

[Curmudgeon]

If I understand him correctly, his brother is not available to transfer it to him at this point.

You misunderstood. Read the OP again.

Edit: never mind, I misread, I think. Too many uses of "he".

[Hawk]

Once a gun enters a bound book at an FFL, which is what you're doing, it becomes the property of that person or the FFL. A guy I know had some guns stolen from his house. Filed a police report, and found the guns. Called the police and had them meet him at the gun shop. Showed the police report to the officers with the make, model, and serial number. The guy told him he could have them back for what he paid for them, around 700 bucks if I recall correctly. He said no, they're his and he bought stolen weapons, they should be returned to him. The police said the gun shop was right. I believe the ATF sided with him as well...


-Chaz

I'm a bit confused.

1. A guy has his guns stolen.
2. He finds them in a gun store.
3. He has the police meet him at said gun store.
4. The guy requests that the stolen firearms be returned back to him.
5. The guy is told that he has to pay the gun store what they have in to it in order to get them back.
6. The police agree that this is the process and the ATF agrees?

Somethings wrong with this ^. I find this difficult to accept at face value.

If I had jewelry stolen from my house and found them for sale in the local pawn shop, called the police and it was confirmed the jewelry was indeed my stolen jewelry, according the the above scenario, I'd have to pay the pawn shop to get my jewelry back?

Unless I'm missing something, receiving stolen property is receiving stolen property, regardless of who originally stole it. Unless (under some law) gun stores and firearms are exempt?

[Chazman321]

I said the same thing Hawk, I didn't understand it either, but I've never had a reason not to trust the man before...

A client actually stole a Playstation 2 from our day program and sold it at the pawn shop for 45 bucks, we had to pay to get it back as well even with the police there... I didn't understand that one either...


-Chaz

[GunLawyer001]

The gun is technically contraband at this point, but it could probably be made legal going forward, in a practical sense. A "loan" to a PA LTCF holder is legal, but a "transfer" from brother to brother requires an FFL. So you had 2 illegal transfers, one to the brother, then a second to the OP.

The brother now being in Texas makes a convenient FFL transfer tricky. If you can find an FFL willing to do a transfer from you to yourself, then that at least would put it into the Database and avoid awkward questions. If it's stolen, then there will be additional troubles.

As for title to stolen goods: There's something in the UCC that some say does convey good title to goods even if the seller lacked good title, but to be honest I've not dealt with it in any detail, and I don't believe it applies to goods that were stolen from the rightful owner. When the thief sells it to a pawnshop, I don't believe it applies, and I'm aware of a number of incidents where gun shops and pawnshops had to hand over stolen goods to the rightful owner, and seek any compensation from the thief they bought it from.
Here's a discussion that seems plausible to me, but again, I've never had reason to research it:
http://community.lawyers.com/forums/t/56466.aspx

That's just some anonymous posters on the Internet, but I also would not rely on the legal advice of your average responding cop, or even whomever answers the phone at ATF. If it's important to you, pay a professional to find out the current legal situation.