Spouse and LTCF questions

[berettajones]

I tried searching for this, but I didn't have very much luck. I remember reading a while back about how if you have a LTCF there are some parts of it that your spouse will inherit. Such as, if the loaded handgun is in the car with her but she is not licensed it is still legal because I have a LTCF and we are married.

I don't know if this is true. However if it is true, are there any other benefits like this?

Yes, I know she should get herself a LTCF but...she doesn't want one...go figure.

[donm]

I think you're referring to this exception to § 6106. Firearms not to be carried without a license.

(13) Any person who is otherwise eligible to possess a firearm under this chapter and who is operating a motor vehicle which is registered in the person's name or the name of a spouse or parent and which contains a firearm for which a valid license has been issued pursuant to section 6109 to the spouse or parent owning the firearm.

The wording is kind of screwy (implies that the firearm is "licensed"). I think it was to address a situation where the child of someone with a LTCF was arrested because the parent had left a handgun in his car.

[TaePo]

Please see the Reference Library link of this site in the upper right black band...

18 Pa.C.S. § 6106: Firearms not to be carried without a license


(a) Offense defined.--


(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), any person who carries a firearm in any vehicle or any person who carries a firearm concealed on or about his person, except in his place of abode or fixed place of business, without a valid and lawfully issued license under this chapter commits a felony of the third degree.

(2) A person who is otherwise eligible to possess a [FN1] valid license under this chapter but carries a firearm in any vehicle or any person who carries a firearm concealed on or about his person, except in his place of abode or fixed place of business, without a valid and lawfully issued license and has not committed any other criminal violation commits a misdemeanor of the first degree.



(b) Exceptions.--The provisions of subsection (a) shall not apply to:



Edited for brevity...



(13) Any person who is otherwise eligible to possess a firearm under this chapter and who is operating a motor vehicle which is registered in the person's name or the name of a spouse or parent and which contains a firearm for which a valid license has been issued pursuant to section 6109 to the spouse or parent owning the firearm.

Edited for brevity...

Note that there are limitations.
The person in the car must be eligible to possess a firearm. Your minor child would not count for example nor a spouse who is prohibited. The car must be in that person's name or the name of a spouse or parent. The firearm should be owned by the parent or spouse. IANAL.

I believe the intent here is to not crucify someone legally because a licensed person left the gun in the car somewhere (glove box, safe, trunk, seat pocket etc.) and forgot it was there.

[str8shooter]

From 18 Pa.C.S. § 6106: Firearms not to be carried without a license

Your wife would be covered under exception 13 if the vehicle is registered in yours or both your names and you hold a valid LTCF, as long as she's not prohibited from owning a firearm.

Although personally, I wouldn't put it to the test.

(13) Any person who is otherwise eligible to possess a firearm under this chapter and who is operating a motor vehicle which is registered in the person's name or the name of a spouse or parent and which contains a firearm for which a valid license has been issued pursuant to section 6109 to the spouse or parent owning the firearm.

AFAIK, there are no other provisions under 18 Pa.C.S. § 6109: Licenses that are "inherited" or otherwise transfer from LTCF holder to their spouse.

oblig: IANAL


ETA: Too slow, already answered.

[TaePo]

I think you're referring to this exception to § 6106. Firearms not to be carried without a license.
The wording is kind of screwy (implies that the firearm is "licensed"). I think it was to address a situation where the child of someone with a LTCF was arrested because the parent had left a handgun in his car.

This brings up an interesting point (we simultaneously posted!), does one have to prove ownership and how? By the non-registry incomplete sales database kept by the State Police?

[DrillNFill]

I have a sort of related question. I have my LTCF, my wife does not (yet). She just bought her first ever firearm, a .22 revolver. She bought it, I'm not on the paperwork at all. If we go to the range together, can we leave it in the car while we stop off for lunch or something after leaving the range? I know if she was by herself shed have to come straight home. What if I'm with her?

Also, if I wanted to go to the range by myself, could I take her gun with me even though my wife is the owner? It is fun to plink with.

I'm sure you guys know better than me

[Nucking Futs]

I have a sort of related question. I have my LTCF, my wife does not (yet). She just bought her first ever firearm, a .22 revolver. She bought it, I'm not on the paperwork at all. If we go to the range together, can we leave it in the car while we stop off for lunch or something after leaving the range? I know if she was by herself shed have to come straight home. What if I'm with her?

Also, if I wanted to go to the range by myself, could I take her gun with me even though my wife is the owner? It is fun to plink with.

I'm sure you guys know better than me

I will leave that one up to someone a little more versed than myself!

Another variation I wonder is if: you are in your car, you have your concealed handgun on your person and another is in the glovebox, you are with a buddy (obviously not married and not family) that does not have his LTCF. You stop at a gas station and you go inside, he is still in your car with your concealed handgun. How does that one work? Is there anything illegal here?

[soccerdad]

I have a sort of related question. I have my LTCF, my wife does not (yet). She just bought her first ever firearm, a .22 revolver. She bought it, I'm not on the paperwork at all. If we go to the range together, can we leave it in the car while we stop off for lunch or something after leaving the range? I know if she was by herself shed have to come straight home. What if I'm with her?

Also, if I wanted to go to the range by myself, could I take her gun with me even though my wife is the owner? It is fun to plink with.

I'm sure you guys know better than me

IANAL...but here goes.

In PA, guns are not "registered" ...gun purchases are recorded. Important distinction. With my LTCF...in PA I can carry whatever gun I want and as many as I want, as long as I obtained them legally. If she is by herself...yup...to and from only. Otherwise..party on.

And props to you for gettin' the little lady involved....I can't get my wife to the range at all.

[soccerdad]

I will leave that one up to someone a little more versed than myself!

Another variation I wonder is if: you are in your car, you have your concealed handgun on your person and another is in the glovebox, you are with a buddy (obviously not married and not family) that does not have his LTCF. You stop at a gas station and you go inside, he is still in your car with your concealed handgun. How does that one work? Is there anything illegal here?

Over thinking it...no worries.

Unless of course he friggin pulls it out and is playing with it and someone sees..and calls the cops....you see where Im going? Over thinking....

[TaePo]

Over thinking it...no worries.

Unless of course he friggin pulls it out and is playing with it and someone sees..and calls the cops....you see where Im going? Over thinking....

I think GL could expand on this regarding constructive possession.

If the 'friend' is a prohibited person, there may be issues. Plus the owner could be in trouble for allowing access but I am not certain on this point. I would assume the state had to prove he knew his buddy was prohibited and he intentionally left it there.

The statute we referenced allows for a spouse or child but does not allow for a 'friend' (or cousin etc. for that matter). Therefore, I would not recommend ever doing it or 'not worrying about it'.

Sure, it is concealed, but what if a vehicle matching yours (or you or your friend's description) had robbed a bank and police roll up on your car while he is there. Or your friend is known to the police and has warrants or any other reasons (accidents) an officer might check the vehicle.

IANAL.