Invited to a neighborhood CeaseFirePa meeting

[Greywolf]

I think this is very telling. They have lost the legal battle (Heller) and are moving on to the "hearts and minds" approach... with feel good language. Just like the Progressives of old.. change the words, change the tone, accomplish the same thing.

Having lost the battle to proclaim that the 2nd Amendment refers only to the National Guard (the "militia"), they now don't want to discuss it and they now profess to support it. But ... they are hanging their collective hat on the unfortunate dicta in Heller that referred to the fact that the RKBA is subject to "reasonable" regulation. Naturally, their view is that any and every regulation they propose is "reasonable," and that anyone who disagrees is simply UNreasonable.

I'm still pee ohed at Mr. Justice Scalia for writing that into the decision, but I have always believed that it was necessary to keep Mr. Justice Kennedy on our side.

[bluedog46]

4. Dan Muroff Exec Dir spoke- CFPa not antigun. CFPa purpose is to stop gun violence. Need to stop illegal sales of guns. Not about taking guns away. Regarding the 2nd Amendment, we are thrilled that the Supreme Court has confirmed it.


Ok I have issue with this part especially. Most of these people are probably what most of us would call very liberal. They want to worry about guns and not the problems that cause the crime that will continue even with more gun control.

There is a deficit of decency in our country. Just to give a high crime area like philadelphia.
1, you have a large minority population that commits a majority of the crime
2, Said minority has been given by liberals a victim mentality and entitlement mentality so when they do something accountability is not often taken.
3 the schools often suck because most of the kids dont want to learn and its hard to get decent teachers there.
4 single mother households with bady daddys who are in jail are the norm.
5 all this ads up to a a generation of people who grow up hating the world and thinking the world owes them. These people people eventually fall in with other minorities who blame the man for all their problems and dont look at the problem itself. They grow up and commit crimes and the race card gets thrown and sometimes they get out of things ( see jena 6 and compare with the duke lacrosse case if you dont see the double standard or refuse to). They grow up uneducated, feeling entitled and with only the basic instinct of food and sex they turn to crimes and create large amounts of clones of themselves.

People like those on that gun control group help by things like
1 support of politicians who want to keep the plantation going
2 believe welfare is better than work because you can control people's votes that way
3 make excuses ( see liberals arguents on affirmative action or illegal immigrant amnesty and notice how accountability of the effected group is never brought up. Its the man's fault)
4, look at the victims and perps in places like Jersey and Illinoise wear decent people cant have guns for protection. The crooks still get their guns ( often an opposed group that keep liberals in power). Their victims, when not killing each other as the law of the jungle, they attack decent hard working people who cant protect themselves.
5. To each his own on this, but these liberals do everything they can to wipe God from the public. You dont need a sociology degree to know that our schools have become more violent and less effective the more God has been taken out and replaced by the false gods of political correctness and multi-culturalism

When they want to talk about that and those issues we can solve the problem and not have to worry about limiting the second amendment. Being born black will not mean you are more likely to commit a crime or end up in jail.

That is how we can get to true equality in the country as Americans. That is the one thing the liberals dont want. Without a "downtroden group" there are no votes to pander for. They actually have to earn votes by doing what is good for the country.


"We are all entitled to our own opinions but not our own facts"

This is one of those inconvienient truths that most would dismiss as racist without any regard for facts.

Rant off.

[bogey1]

Rant off.

Thats not a rant. Thats the damn truth... Good post BD.

[bluedog46]

Thats not a rant. Thats the damn truth... Good post BD.

Thank you, but there are many that see any discussion of race to be racist even when its the facts. Those people should really read it and notice my goal is for equal rights for all and special rights for none.

[oldgun]

Mentioned a foundation that is providing $$$ to start the Where Did The Gun Come From program. Will be starting this in Pittsburgh area.

It is interesting how this will proceed. It could either be a money pit for them which is good or it could change Federal law if they figure out where to spend their totalitarian money. I say this because the only way they can "trace" a gun is to repeal the Tiahrt Amendment to start. Then I think they will probably run into a lot of other roadblocks as they are not law enforcement in any shape or form and compelling dealers and out of state distributers to comply will take many thousands of lawsuits. I believe this attempt at control is directly from the MAIG playbook and AFAIK has been a loser so far. Perhaps the foundation these communists speak of is MAIG.

[PhillyVet]

One thing I learned in business school was; if you keep having to rebrand your product, you don’t have a good product. The Brady Campaign was founded in 1974 and has changed its name (and publicly stated goals) at least three times – whereas the NRA was founded in 1871 (103 years old when HCI was founded) and has never changed its name.. It says something about what people truly think about the basic “product” gun controllers are selling.

[Greywolf]

One thing I learned in business school was; if you keep having to rebrand your product, you don’t have a good product. The Brady Campaign was founded in 1974 and has changed its name (and publicly stated goals) at least three times – whereas the NRA was founded in 1871 (103 years old when HCI was founded) and has never changed its name.. It says something about what people truly think about the basic “product” gun controllers are selling.

However, the NRA has significantly changed its "product."

I belong to the NRA and I am an NRA-certified instructor, but I don't approve of much that they do, I loathe their scare-monger fundraising tactics, and I think Wayne Lapiere's salary and compensation package is obscene.

[IGPJAP]

4. Dan Muroff Exec Dir spoke- CFPa not antigun. CFPa purpose is to stop gun violence. Need to stop illegal sales of guns. Not about taking guns away. Regarding the 2nd Amendment, we are thrilled that the Supreme Court has confirmed it.


Ok I have issue with this part especially. Most of these people are probably what most of us would call very liberal. They want to worry about guns and not the problems that cause the crime that will continue even with more gun control.

There is a deficit of decency in our country. Just to give a high crime area like philadelphia.
1, you have a large minority population that commits a majority of the crime
2, Said minority has been given by liberals a victim mentality and entitlement mentality so when they do something accountability is not often taken.
3 the schools often suck because most of the kids dont want to learn and its hard to get decent teachers there.
4 single mother households with bady daddys who are in jail are the norm.
5 all this ads up to a a generation of people who grow up hating the world and thinking the world owes them. These people people eventually fall in with other minorities who blame the man for all their problems and dont look at the problem itself. They grow up and commit crimes and the race card gets thrown and sometimes they get out of things ( see jena 6 and compare with the duke lacrosse case if you dont see the double standard or refuse to). They grow up uneducated, feeling entitled and with only the basic instinct of food and sex they turn to crimes and create large amounts of clones of themselves.

People like those on that gun control group help by things like
1 support of politicians who want to keep the plantation going
2 believe welfare is better than work because you can control people's votes that way
3 make excuses ( see liberals arguents on affirmative action or illegal immigrant amnesty and notice how accountability of the effected group is never brought up. Its the man's fault)
4, look at the victims and perps in places like Jersey and Illinoise wear decent people cant have guns for protection. The crooks still get their guns ( often an opposed group that keep liberals in power). Their victims, when not killing each other as the law of the jungle, they attack decent hard working people who cant protect themselves.
5. To each his own on this, but these liberals do everything they can to wipe God from the public. You dont need a sociology degree to know that our schools have become more violent and less effective the more God has been taken out and replaced by the false gods of political correctness and multi-culturalism

When they want to talk about that and those issues we can solve the problem and not have to worry about limiting the second amendment. Being born black will not mean you are more likely to commit a crime or end up in jail.

That is how we can get to true equality in the country as Americans. That is the one thing the liberals dont want. Without a "downtroden group" there are no votes to pander for. They actually have to earn votes by doing what is good for the country.


"We are all entitled to our own opinions but not our own facts"

This is one of those inconvienient truths that most would dismiss as racist without any regard for facts.

Rant off.

You need help

[Dannytheman]

However, the NRA has significantly changed its "product."

I belong to the NRA and I am an NRA-certified instructor, but I don't approve of much that they do, I loathe their scare-monger fundraising tactics, and I think Wayne Lapiere's salary and compensation package is obscene.

Let's give it some time in Obama's 2nd term to decide if they are scare tactics or not. Rarely does anyone agree 100% with any National organization as large as the NRA. That being said I appreciate you being a member, and you need to succinctly let your voice be heard. How many board members have you told of your loathing?
Wayne's salary is an easy target, but it is straight in line with other organizations that have the revenue flow of the NRA. He leads a huge ship. That ship creates huge revenues and not just from memberships. (Friends of NRA, PVF, Whittingham Center, Certifying trainers and shooters, etc., etc.)

I hear often these arguments, but what I ask is for someone to name a better solution. We got our asses kicked in this election because we have some conservative members who didn't vote, or voted Libertarian, because they didn't like Romney or other reasons of theirs. We also have some liberal members who voted for Obama because of the color of his skin. If we could have truly turned out the 4.5 members, or get 10 million gun owners who think they are in the NRA to have voted, we would have won this election.

The NRA is changing right now. New members are not hunters, they are shooters and self defense oriented. In that flux is going to be misdirection and some conflict. A huge ship does not turn easily or stop on a dime, believe me.

In PA, I think the State associations could use some serious help. FOAC does great things, but is way to small. Most PA gun owners don't even know who the official NRA sanctioned State group is.

Now the people of PA have elected the first AG democrat and woman who already signed on to a letter against National Reciprocity.(She ain't even sworn in yet)

We better stop quibbling amongst ourselves and present a united front or we will get plowed over in the next 4 years, mark my words.

This thread shows you that there is an enemy out there, and the OP presented their case and strategy to us. We need more of this type of infiltration so we can move and deflect their movement.

[ChamberedRound]

Thank you, but there are many that see any discussion of race to be racist even when its the facts. Those people should really read it and notice my goal is for equal rights for all and special rights for none.

All due respect, but there was no mention of race in this thread, or in the meeting notes provided by M1aFan. The only one who appears to want to make this a discussion of race is you. This thread was meant to be about what M1aFan saw and heard at a CeaseFire meeting; let's keep it that way, and not wander off into an off-topic diatribe of race. While I don't have a problem with race being part of a discussion, and while a mere mention of race isn't racist in and of itself, I don't see how race is a factor in the scope of this thread or discussion. Especially at a CeaseFire meeting in Radnor, where I'll wager a bet that most of the attendees looking for more gun restrictions were not racial minorities whom you claim are the problem.

This isn't the first time you've tried to troll a thread with a somewhat-related-but-not-really post that pushed your own agenda; stop trying to steer the discussion away from the core issue, which is what CeaseFire is up to these days and how they're trying to get more people on-board.

You need help

This post doesn't help either. Either positively contribute to the thread, or don't.