is concealed carry permisable at 30th Street Station

[Retired S/A]

Is concealed carry permisable at 30th Street Station in Philadelphia? I have both a LTCF and a Leosa card. I will not be boarding any trains but rather picking up two people. I know if I don't go into the station that I'll be ok. My question is if I conceal carry into the main public area of the station am I violating any laws?

[jerryg]

I would think it would be just like the public area of an airport and it would be ok. IANAL

[TommyJefferson]

30th St Station belongs to Amtrak and I don't believe they allow firearms on their property unless in checked baggage. So it's probably the same as a business with a no firearms sign posted. I believe you're ok as far as federal and PA law but it could be considered trespassing, and that place is crawling with LEOs.

[SAB215]

I know a while ago you couldn't have a gun on an Amtrak train, checked or otherwise. That was reversed in 2010. I don't think you're allowed to carry on the train, though.

The station, however, I can't see them regulating since SEPTA also runs trains through there. I have carried in there several times myself.

The rail "police" mostly stand around with their dogs talking to each other anyway. They wouldn't stop shit even if anything did happen.

[tl_3237]

Here's Amtrak's position:

Fifth, Sergeant Cameron correctly notified your client that carrying a firearm on Amtrak-owned private property is prohibited. This includes Amtrak stations, such as 30th' Street Station. Such regulations are posted at 30th Street Station under Amtrak's Station Rules of Conduct.

http://forum.pafoa.org/general-2/269...tml#post379268

AFAIK there's been no material change in that policy with the exception of the checked baggage allowance.

[volanova]

Here's Amtrak's position:



http://forum.pafoa.org/general-2/269...tml#post379268

AFAIK there's been no material change in that policy with the exception of the checked baggage allowance.

I wonder what the status of the SEPTA portion is. IANAL, but if that section of the building is leased to and controlled by SEPTA, one would think that someone entering that portion would be subject to SEPTA's rules and regulations (which do not preclude carrying since they are an entity of local government). Otherwise, if you were legally carrying on SEPTA and needed to make a transfer, you'd have to go to Suburban or Market East to do it. Or am I completely off base with that?

[lprgcFrank]

Here's Amtrak's position:



http://forum.pafoa.org/general-2/269...tml#post379268

AFAIK there's been no material change in that policy with the exception of the checked baggage allowance.

I don't carry in 30th st station anymore per the above - but since I won't spend any $ with Amtrak until they change the policy them....

[tl_3237]

I wonder what the status of the SEPTA portion is. IANAL, but if that section of the building is leased to and controlled by SEPTA, one would think that someone entering that portion would be subject to SEPTA's rules and regulations (which do not preclude carrying since they are an entity of local government). Otherwise, if you were legally carrying on SEPTA and needed to make a transfer, you'd have to go to Suburban or Market East to do it. Or am I completely off base with that?

Though I'm unaware of any prohibition by SEPTA, they are a state agency - not local and therefore not preempted by 6120.

THe 30th Street Building is Amtrak property. Unless SEPTA's lease state otherwise regarding firearms (highly unlikely), I would think that Amtrak's policy prevails.

[gascolator]

Just to be a bit obtuse about it:

If you arrive on a SEPTA train, you don't pass any "No firearms" signs in the process. Hence you aren't defying any lawfully posted sign.

If you then leave the station, you're in the process of leaving, i.e., complying with the policy which you didn't see upon your arrival, and which you're unlikely to see until (presuming it is properly posted) your return.

Same story if you get off one train and board another train.

The potential for making things difficult at all three of the center city stations is quite high. Most of the paths in or out of Suburban and Market East stations are through some sort of private or quasi-private property. For example, if you exit Market East station at the Convention Center end, have you violated the Convention Centers rules? The Gallery at Market East is a no-firearms zone that sits directly between that SEPTA station and access to/from many of the surrounding streets. And it isn't entirely clear where the Gallery begins and the station ends.

[MaxKlinger]

Just to be a bit obtuse about it:
The potential for making things difficult at all three of the center city stations is quite high. Most of the paths in or out of Suburban and Market East stations are through some sort of private or quasi-private property. For example, if you exit Market East station at the Convention Center end, have you violated the Convention Centers rules? ...And it isn't entirely clear where the Gallery begins and the station ends.

Disagree. There are DIRECT entrances to Suburban Station and Market East Station that do not go through private property or the Gallery. Get to know where they are, and use them. The entrances to the Gallery are locked at night, which is frustrating as hell if you're trying to get a train home. The Market East entrance on at 11th and Filbert is always open and does not go through private property. I believe the same can be said for the Suburban entrances at 18th and JFK, 17th and JFK, and 16th and JFK, all of which empty directly onto the ticketing concourse.

I just avoid using 30th anymore. It is Amtrak policy and Amtrak owns the station. SEPTA simply uses a portion of the station.