Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Tresspassing While Carrying

    I am a photographer and occasionally go on adventures to explore and take photos of abandoned places. My question is if someone is legally carrying and is caught trespassing does that make the charge more serious than a fine in PA? I know it differs from State to State.

    Please not lectures about trespassing.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by GRfoto View Post
    I am a photographer and occasionally go on adventures to explore and take photos of abandoned places. My question is if someone is legally carrying and is caught trespassing does that make the charge more serious than a fine in PA? I know it differs from State to State.

    Please not lectures about trespassing.
    My best advice, call a lawyer.

    My far from best, non lawyer, non legal comment (not advice), based off my personal research is.

    There is no additional charge beyond trespassing.

    Even ignoring a no-guns sign is only considered trespassing.

    Most of the talk around here is about places open to the public that have a sign or don't have a sign but are then asked to leave upon discovered being armed.

    My understanding is that its more severe if someone "gains entry by subterfuge" this Criminal Trespass and is a felony vs. ignoring some sign at a public place that is a misdemeanor or summary offense depending on if you leave or not.

    Link to the relevant text.
    http://law.onecle.com/pennsylvania/c...5.003.000.html
    Last edited by QuackXP; February 15th, 2012 at 03:06 PM.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    If your not OC, no one should ever know your carrying in the first place. Unless you are being detained and searched.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    The only thing I can find that may come close is Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 907. But that requires intent to employ it criminally.

    § 907. Possessing instruments of crime

    (a) Criminal instruments generally.--A person commits a misdemeanor of the first degree if he possesses any instrument of crime with intent to employ it criminally.

    (b) Possession of weapon.--A person commits a misdemeanor of the first degree if he possesses a firearm or other weapon concealed upon his person with intent to employ it criminally.

    (c) Unlawful body armor.--A person commits a felony of the third degree if in the course of the commission of a felony or in the attempt to commit a felony he uses or wears body armor or has in his control, custody or possession any body armor.

    (d) Definitions.--As used in this section, the following words and phrases shall have the meanings given to them in this subsection:

    “Body armor.” Any protective covering for the body, or parts thereof, made of any polyaramid fiber or any resin-treated glass fiber cloth or any material or combination of materials made or designed to prevent, resist, deflect or deter the penetration thereof by ammunition, knife, cutting or piercing instrument or any other weapon.

    “Instrument of crime.” Any of the following:

    (1) Anything specially made or specially adapted for criminal use.

    (2) Anything used for criminal purposes and possessed by the actor under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for lawful uses it may have.

    “Weapon.” Anything readily capable of lethal use and possessed under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for lawful uses which it may have. The term includes a firearm which is not loaded or lacks a clip or other component to render it immediately operable, and components which can readily be assembled into a weapon.

    Trespassing is still trespassing though. It isn't a criminal act until certain criteria is made. Be sure to read up on Title 18, Chapter 35, Subsection 3502(burglary) and 3503(trespass). If it has to do with railroad properties, research subsection 3504 as well.

    Be careful. It's a fine line you walk when dealing with trespass and abandoned properties. Like I said above, it isn't criminal unless certain criteria is met.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J.

    Don't end up in my signature!

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by ScarMack View Post
    If your not OC, no one should ever know your carrying in the first place. Unless you are being detained and searched.
    +1

    A guy with a camera is probably just going to be asked to leave. A guy with a firearm and law enforcement is probably on it's way.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by ScarMack View Post
    If your not OC, no one should ever know your carrying in the first place. Unless you are being detained and searched.
    True, I would never dream of open carrying in that situation. If all they would do is ask me to leave then they have no way of knowing I even have a gun. I just wanted to know for peace of mind's sake.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by QuackXP View Post
    My best advice, call a lawyer.

    My far from best, non lawyer, non legal comment (not advice), based off my personal research is.

    There is no additional charge beyond trespassing.

    Even ignoring a no-guns sign is only considered trespassing.

    Most of the talk around here is about places open to the public that have a sign or don't have a sign but are then asked to leave upon discovered being armed.

    My understanding is that its more severe if someone "gains entry by subterfuge" this Criminal Trespass and is a felony vs. ignoring some sign at a public place that is a misdemeanor or summary offense depending on if you leave or not.

    Link to the relevant text.
    http://law.onecle.com/pennsylvania/c...5.003.000.html
    Thanks for the info, it seems like you are right. I think you are also right about my best bet would be to ask a lawyer.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by knight0334 View Post
    The only thing I can find that may come close is Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 907. But that requires intent to employ it criminally.




    Trespassing is still trespassing though. It isn't a criminal act until certain criteria is made. Be sure to read up on Title 18, Chapter 35, Subsection 3502(burglary) and 3503(trespass). If it has to do with railroad properties, research subsection 3504 as well.

    Be careful. It's a fine line you walk when dealing with trespass and abandoned properties. Like I said above, it isn't criminal unless certain criteria is met.
    Thanks, will definitely read over that.
    Last edited by GRfoto; February 15th, 2012 at 03:30 PM. Reason: typo

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by GRfoto View Post
    I am a photographer and occasionally go on adventures to explore and take photos of abandoned places. My question is if someone is legally carrying and is caught trespassing does that make the charge more serious than a fine in PA? I know it differs from State to State.

    Please not lectures about trespassing.
    So do you want to know about carrying a gun in case you are confronted for trespassing? Is this for defense against property owners or other trespassers?

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Tresspassing While Carrying

    Quote Originally Posted by GRfoto View Post
    No, definitely not. If an owner asked me to leave I would leave without problem. 9 times out of 10 I don't even see another person there. But I do know that some abandoned places attract squatters. They can be unfriendly sometimes.
    I am going to respect your wishes and not lecture you with my thoughts on trespassing, but I do have to say, if you have to defend yourself against anyone for any reason while trespassing, you are going to have a very steep uphill climb in order to justify yourself in court.

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