OC in the car

**.45springfield** · February 6th, 2012, 05:41 PM

I have a question regarding Open Carry. I have a state issued PA LTCF and I was wondering if this makes me eligible to carry my gun in plain sight on an outside-the-waistband holster while driving or riding in the car? After reading the PA UFA I'm almost sure it's allowed but I've had people tell me that only concealed carry is allowed in vehicles if you have an LTCF. Thank You!

**Sigfan22** · February 6th, 2012, 05:51 PM

Your good to go just don't have a loaded rifle in car

**Curmudgeon** · February 6th, 2012, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by Sigfan22

Your good to go just don't have a loaded rifle in car

+1 on no loaded long guns.

Well done, .45springfield, on checking the PA UFA and seeing for yourself that "others" are wrong.

The only place you have been required to carry concealed is in state Parks, and even that is questionable as of the passing of HB40.

**QuackXP** · February 6th, 2012, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by .45springfield

I have a question regarding Open Carry. I have a state issued PA LTCF and I was wondering if this makes me eligible to carry my gun in plain sight on an outside-the-waistband holster while driving or riding in the car? After reading the PA UFA I'm almost sure it's allowed but I've had people tell me that only concealed carry is allowed in vehicles if you have an LTCF. Thank You!

Without a LTCF only OC on foot is allowed. For any type of carry in a motor vehcile (car, motorcycle, cab, bus, etc) you need a LTCF.

In practice though you still need a LTCF unless you plan to walk everywhere. This is because to simply transport a unloaded firearm without a LTCF you can only transport it directly to and from any of your residences, places of business, gun shop, repair center, range, or place of assembly, without any stops.

So you cannot simply transport an unloaded firearm to a place that is not listed above then load it and OC.

There is however legislation being considered to remove the restrictions on where you can transport a firearm without a LTCF.

As others have said no loaded long arms in any vehicle anytime.

With a LTCF you can carry CC or OC anywhere, except for certain restricted areas like courthouses, federal buildings, air-side terminals, etc.

**.45springfield** · February 6th, 2012, 07:13 PM

Thank you all for your help in clarifying this for me!

**dgood71** · February 8th, 2012, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Sigfan22

Your good to go just don't have a loaded rifle in car

Why are rifles singled out? Game laws? If you've got a citation please post it -- especially for clarification on whether it's "rifles" specifically or all long guns, which would likely include shotguns.

Thanks!

Edit -- just found 34 PA C.S. 2503 in the game laws which does indicate that only a "pistol or revolver" is lawful to be carried loaded in a vehicle with a LTCF. I'm guessing this is the statute that you were referring to.

**BimmerJon** · February 8th, 2012, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by QuackXP

Without a LTCF only OC on foot is allowed. For any type of carry in a motor vehcile (car, motorcycle, cab, bus, etc) you need a LTCF.

In Philly, you need a LTCF (or reciprocal) to Open Carry a firearm and/or long gun (in vehicle, long guns must always be unloaded. Firearms can be loaded). During a State of Emergency, you also require a LTCF to OC or CC, even outside of Philly.

There is no such thing as "Transport" or "Open Carry" or "Concealed Carry" in a vehicle... it is simply "Carry".

Originally Posted by QuackXP

In practice though you still need a LTCF unless you plan to walk everywhere. This is because to simply transport a unloaded firearm without a LTCF you can only transport it directly to and from any of your residences, places of business, gun shop, repair center, range, or place of assembly, without any stops.

To carry a firearm in a vehicle, you only require a permit/license from ANY state. Doesn't have to be a PA LTCF or reciprocal with PA.
Again, in Philly... you need a LTCF or license from reciprocal state to even "walk around OC".

**JayBell** · February 8th, 2012, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by dgood71

Why are rifles singled out? Game laws? If you've got a citation please post it -- especially for clarification on whether it's "rifles" specifically or all long guns, which would likely include shotguns.

Thanks!

Edit -- just found 34 PA C.S. 2503 in the game laws which does indicate that only a "pistol or revolver" is lawful to be carried loaded in a vehicle with a LTCF. I'm guessing this is the statute that you were referring to.

I'm sure someone will pop up with a longarm cite shortly, i dont have it at my fingertips, but longarms, both rifles and shotguns are not "firearms" for the purpose of carry under your license to carry firearms.

the "firearms" for LTCF purposes are :
pistol or revolver with a barrel of 15" or less
rifle with a barrel less than 16"
shotgun with a barrel less than 18"

obviously, the last 2 are NFA firearms, and are only legal to possess in PA if they are registered pursuant to the NFA Act of 1934, and as they qualify as "firearms" for LTCF purposes they may be carried loaded upon the person, or in your vehicle.

title 1 length rifles and shotguns may not be carried loaded in your vehicle, and loose rounds or loaded magazines may not be in the same "compartment" of the case as the longarm, as that is also considered "loaded"

**tl_3237** · February 8th, 2012, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by dgood71

Why are rifles singled out? Game laws? If you've got a citation please post it -- especially for clarification on whether it's "rifles" specifically or all long guns, which would likely include shotguns.

Thanks!

Edit -- just found 34 PA C.S. 2503 in the game laws which does indicate that only a "pistol or revolver" is lawful to be carried loaded in a vehicle with a LTCF. I'm guessing this is the statute that you were referring to.

Title 34 may or may not be applicable depending on the circumstances. However:

18 Pa.C.S. § 6106.1: Carrying loaded weapons other than firearms

(a) General rule.-- Except as provided in Title 34 (relating to game), no person shall carry a loaded pistol, revolver, shotgun or rifle, other than a firearm as defined in section 6102 (relating to definitions), in any vehicle. The provisions of this section shall not apply to persons excepted from the requirement of a license to carry firearms under section 6106(b)(1), (2), (5) or (6) (relating to firearms not to be carried without a license) nor shall the provisions of this section be construed to permit persons to carry firearms in a vehicle where such conduct is prohibited by section 6106.
(b) Penalty.--A person who violates the provisions of this section commits a summary offense.

Your LTCF allows you to carry a 6102 firearm (handgun, SBR, SBS) in any manner (OC/CC) in a vehicle (loaded or unloaded) but it does not extend that allowance to longarms.

**dgood71** · February 8th, 2012, 03:33 PM

Originally Posted by tl_3237

Your LTCF allows you to carry a 6102 firearm (handgun, SBR, SBS) in any manner (OC/CC) in a vehicle (loaded or unloaded) but it does not extend that allowance to longarms.

Thanks. I made note of this in my PA Firearms law notebook. I knew game law prohibited loaded long guns in vehicles while hunting, but I hadn't realized that they are prohibited elsewhere in state law as well. Good to know.