PA resident buying ammo in NJ

[Statkowski]

NJS 2C:58-3.3 "Handgun ammunition" defined; sale, purchase, etc., regulated; violation, fourth degree crime.

1. a. As used in this act, "handgun ammunition" means ammunition specifically designed to be used only in a handgun. "

Hmmm, so what about 9mm Luger ammunition? Or, 40-cal. S&W ammunition? Or, .45-cal. ACP ammunition? As the law is written, these would be exempt since Hi-Point and others make carbines, which are not handguns, that handle such. My Hi-Point 995TSRD fires standard 9mm Luger cartridges, which apparently are not designed to be use only in a handgun.

[tl_3237]

Hmmm, so what about 9mm Luger ammunition? Or, 40-cal. S&W ammunition? Or, .45-cal. ACP ammunition? As the law is written, these would be exempt since Hi-Point and others make carbines, which are not handguns, that handle such. My Hi-Point 995TSRD fires standard 9mm Luger cartridges, which apparently are not designed to be use only in a handgun.

That's why I used the introductory word 'Statutorily'.

Dealers must log ALL sales of dual use ammo per administrative code and, as such, the 'handgun only' statutory definition has been blurred. Technically they could make the sale sans NJFID, NJPPH, or NJCCW but those three licenses has become a de facto standard that I'm sure just about all dealers use and most have no idea what the actual statutes indicate. I would be surprised if even their NJSP inspectors knew otherwise.

I doubt that any would be willing to risk their dealer's license on a pushing the issue of the technical 'loophole'.

NJAC § 13:54-3.14 Permanent record of receipt and disposition of firearms and ammunition

(b) Every retail dealer of ammunition shall maintain a permanent record of ammunition acquisition and disposition. The record of purchase or acquisition shall consist of invoices or other commercial records, which shall be filed in an orderly manner separate from other commercial records maintained. Such records shall show the name of the manufacturer, the type, caliber or gauge, quantity of the ammunition acquired in the transaction, the date of each acquisition and from whom received. The record of sale or disposition shall be maintained in a bound form and shall contain the date of the transaction, name of manufacturer, caliber or gauge, quantity of ammunition sold, name, address and date of birth of purchaser, and identification used to establish the identity of purchaser. The dealer shall confirm the age of the purchaser of rifle and shotgun ammunition to be at least 18, and handgun ammunition to be at least 21. No record need be maintained for the sale or disposition of shotgun or rifle ammunition. However, sales or other dispositions of ammunition intended for use in any other firearm and which may be interchangeable between rifles and handguns, as well as hollow-nosed or dum-dum ammunition, must be recorded. The records shall be maintained in chronological order by date of acquisition and disposition and shall be kept at the location the business is being conducted.

be interesting to see when the anti-s will wake up and add other cartridges like 30-30, 30-06, 35 Rem, .410, 45-70, 243 Win etc to cover such pistols as the Thompson Contender, Judge, ... shhhhhh

[LostinGermany]

Wow, this is much more confusing than I thought, NJ is terrible. Woo blurry laws!

[father-of-five]

Directly home? Do they, like, send the police to the nearest McDonalds to make sure you don't stop in the drive-thru for a Coke and some fries? haha.

Glad I don't live there. We came close, at one point, years ago. Phew.

That's what makes New Jersey so annoying. Theoretically, they could do what you said, which is within their extremely vague laws. Rather than it being your right, it becomes your word against that of law enforcement. They might believe you, they might not believe you. It basically makes law abiding citizens look like and feel like criminals.

For such an anti-gun state, I find it ironic that it is a rather lengthy and demeaning process to purchase a firearm, but if you move to New Jersey with firearms, none of the above processes applies!

[Statkowski]

For such an anti-gun state, I find it ironic that it is a rather lengthy and demeaning process to purchase a firearm, but if you move to New Jersey with firearms, none of the above processes applies!

Simply amazing. You can move to New Jersey with your handguns without a FOID/FPID/FID/GPLX/Whatever, but you can't purchase ammunition for them in New Jersey without said ID.

[Boots_DE]

Simply amazing. You can move to New Jersey with your handguns without a FOID/FPID/FID/GPLX/Whatever, ....

Many years ago NJ had a "Permit to Purchase a Handgun", later it was changed to a "Permit to Purchase a Handgun and Form of Register". I think they might have gotten a lot of flak for that because it really isn't legal for them to require registration.

Anyway, I don't know what HG purchase permits look like now. But, you could be a good citizen, uh, I mean 'subject' and fill out a "Voluntary Form of Firearms Registration" if you would like. Looks like this:

http://www.randolphnj.org/pdf/police...tary_sp650.pdf

However, even if you voluntarily 'registered' your firearm, you would still need a NJ FPID to purchase ammo.

[LostinGermany]

Just picked up 1000 rounds from ammo man. Just photo copied my licence, really easy. It was almost like NJ isn't backwards...

[Boots_DE]

Just picked up 1000 rounds from ammo man. Just photo copied my licence, really easy. It was almost like NJ isn't backwards...

Now, try that again with handgun ammo.

[LostinGermany]

Boots_DE - yyyyeah that will not be as easy. I'm going to look into a permit, but I have a feeling it might be impossible for an out of state resident.

[longcall911]

I doubt that any would be willing to risk their dealer's license on a pushing the issue of the technical 'loophole'.

That was exactly my experience. I moved from NJ about 9 months ago. There were numerous times when others in the store who wanted to buy both rifle and handgun ammo were denied the handgun purchase because they did not have their FID on them.

I recall one person arguing "but it's for my 9mm rifle." The store clerk answered, "then you were stupid for buying a rifle that you can't buy ammo for".