Borrowing NFA goods

[H22ate]

I was reading a post on here and it sparked my curiocity.

Theshadow -

"there's a LOT more to that License than the concealment portion. Including but not limited to carry in a declared emergency, being able to stop going to and from a range legally, being able to borrow a firearm. Those are just off the top of my head."

Now that being said, Is it legal to borrow any NFA stuff being that I already own NFA stuff?

Im pretty sure I already know the answer on this but Ive always wondered about it since my buddy and I will trade weapons at the range to shoot each others suppressors.

[GunLawyer001]

"Borrow"? No.

"Use at the range while the registrant stands there and retains custody and control but you get to shoot the gun"? Sure.

[HSR47]

"Borrow"? No.

"Use at the range while the registrant stands there and retains custody and control but you get to shoot the gun"? Sure.

The above is the case with NFA items registered to individuals, and to legal persons that the third party is unassociated with.

However, if the item is registered to a trust or corporation, and you are duly associated with that entity in the proper manner, then you can do pretty much anything you like with the item without worry of running afoul of the NFA -- at least assuming that your actions are not *otherwise* criminal.


Really, this, more than anything else, is the big reason to go with either a trust or a corporation for NFA ownership; It enables issues of possession to be grossly simplified.

[GunLawyer001]

The above is the case with NFA items registered to individuals, and to legal persons that the third party is unassociated with.

However, if the item is registered to a trust or corporation, and you are duly associated with that entity in the proper manner, then you can do pretty much anything you like with the item without worry of running afoul of the NFA -- at least assuming that your actions are not *otherwise* criminal.


Really, this, more than anything else, is the big reason to go with either a trust or a corporation for NFA ownership; It enables issues of possession to be grossly simplified.

Well....no. You can never "borrow" NFA firearms, so there's no exception for NFA firearms owned by paper companies or trusts. And it's more than semantics, there can be no temporary transfer of custody to any non-registrant, so "borrowing" is always forbidden.

If you're an owner or bona fide employee of an LLC, for example, then your possession of its NFA firearms remains possession by the LLC, because you're a bona fide agent. Your actions are the actions of the LLC. No change of custody and control in the view of ATF, it's more like shifting piles of cash around in the same bank vault.

I think it's a bad idea to try to simplify those issues of possession, because it tends to encourage non bona fide activities. You can't (for example) list your shooting buddy as "trustee" of your trust for the weekend, lend him the toys, and expect that sham to survive any scrutiny by any LEO who understands any of the legal issues.

Nor can you just list your friend as "Executive Security Officer" of your corporation, not unless you're paying him, withholding taxes, and providing office space for him to carry out his legitimate duties.

Just writing down somebody's name on a piece of paper does NOT circumvent the NFA, and it's a truly bad idea to treat the NFA casually, unless your Bucket List includes "spending time in a Federal detention facility".

[Noah_Zark]

. . . there can be no temporary transfer of custody to any non-registrant, so "borrowing" is always forbidden.

^^^ This, with the sole exception of temporary transfer to an appropriate FFL/SOT for repair, refinish, etc.

Noah

[GunLawyer001]

^^^ This, with the sole exception of temporary transfer to an appropriate FFL/SOT for repair, refinish, etc.

Noah

True, a gunsmith with appropriate SOT can take custody without a formal transfer, but a pure retail dealer cannot. The police can get away with seizing NFA firearms, too, and I suppose it's not too objectionable to ATF if you surrender an NFA firearm to local cops, even temporarily.

[streaker69]

How is TargetMasters in Chadd's Ford getting away with renting NFA items for use on the range to anyone that walks in the door?

[GunLawyer001]

How is TargetMasters in Chadd's Ford getting away with renting NFA items for use on the range to anyone that walks in the door?

What I embiggened there is the key - no surrender of custody & control while they remain on the property.

[Gun]

What I embiggened there is the key - no surrender of custody & control while they remain on the property.

Not to get off topic, but when I started to enter the word
that I bolded in this quote, the desktop dictionary gave me
this

Em-bi-op-ter-a| Entomology

a small order of insects that comprises the web-spinners

after entering the letters e m b i, before getting to the letter g!


Just sharing, carry on.

[streaker69]

What I embiggened there is the key - no surrender of custody & control while they remain on the property.

Thank you for the most noble and cromulent reply.