1918 Colt 1911 - US Property

[bigdawgbeav]

Hey everyone. Tonight my father was nice enough to lend me his .45. I want to get this cleaned up while still retaining it's value.

Here's what I know about it:
1 - it was manufactured in 1918 as part of a 300K+ batch. (http://proofhouse.com/colt/) (http://www.sightm1911.com/1911Production.htm -

Colt: S/N 290,000 to 450,000 = May, 1918 to Oct. 24, 1918

2 - its stamped "United States Property"

I'm not sure the history of this gun as it was given to my father many years ago by a friend and I can't recall his name or any details of his service. I am 90% certain it saw action in WWII. It needs a good cleaning as the slide is pitted. It's hard to tell in the photos.

What I would like to do:
1 - get it cleaned up - but I don't want to lose the patina as I'm pretty sure that is part of the overall value of the gun
2 - get it smithed - God knows when it was last oiled and the trigger feels really stiff
3 - get some sort of appraisal - anyone have a book that might give me an idea of what this gun costs?

If it turns out that this gun it pretty much worthless, I might consider getting it completely refinished.

I would love to hear some thoughts about it and hear some opinions on my best course of action.

And this post would be incomplete without pictures, so I have attached them. Please let me know what you think.

[autotech6506]

i wouldn't touch it. only thing I would do is oil it so it doesn't rust away. if you do anything more than that you will kill all the value of it. from what I've seen antique or historical firearms are worth more money unrestored.

[Seabee CO]

I have pretty much the exact same pistol. Mine is in the 244K range. Wipe it down with an oily rag and, if you have some rust or freckling, lightly go over those areas with #0000 steel wool soaked in CLP.

Do not refinish the pistol or it will lose any remaining value it has.

[ScotsGuards]

The previous posters are correct. DO NOT get it refinished. Just go over it with a good cleaner and if needed, VERY lightly with the finest steel wool. I'm not sure where you are located but I could do a detail stripping and cleaning for you at my shop. From your remarks the innards sound like they just need a good cleaning. The pistol appears to have the original finish and grips. The magazine is a correct "two-tone" as well.

As for the value; judging from the photos, if the bore is good, the pistol would be worth $800.00-$1000.00 on the open retail market. Less if the bore is frosty or downright shot out.

While not a museum piece, it is a decent example of a historic arm and nice family heirloom. Congrats. PM me if I may be of assistance.

[Flash]

If I were you (which, obviously....) I would find someone knowledgeable about 1911's who could properly field-strip, clean, oil, and reassemble it -WITHOUT MAKING THE "IDIOT-MARK" WORSE THAN IT IS. If that last line leaves you scratching you head, look on the left side of the gun, just behind the trigger, and see the very small, radiused line in the finish that corresponds to the rear end of the slide-lock. That is a sign of the pistol being reassembled without care for the finish in that area. Good pistolsmiths will not make that line in reassembly. That often decreases the value of things like that.

Your pistol is a "1911" model, and without the "A1" suffix, meaning it was a very early model, thus perhaps more valuable. It has the narrow sights, straight backstrap, short trigger and the absence of trigger relief-cuts on the frame.

The magazine pictured is also an early model, observe the different bluing on the top versus the bottom. Valuable.

Flash

[bigdawgbeav]

As for the value; judging from the photos, if the bore is good, the pistol would be worth $800.00-$1000.00 on the open retail market. Less if the bore is frosty or downright shot out.

It looks like the bore is good. There is some fouling in there, but that is probably left over from when my father and I went shooting a couple months ago with it. It hasn't been cleaned since then. Need to get a .45 boresnake.

[PA Rifleman]

...

If it turns out that this gun it pretty much worthless, I might consider getting it completely refinished.

It isn't worthless if it's unmolested. Trust us on this one. Unmolested M1911s vary between expensive to BOING!

I would love to hear some thoughts about it and hear some opinions on my best course of action....

Make NO alterations. Cleaning=ok. Refinishing=not ok. If you want a beater 1911, buy a current production (used or new) 1911 without provenance tied to United States history.

What many gun owners fail to appreciate is when someone's in possession of a significant US military arm, they are also a curator of United States history. The sole reason why it's in your hands and in its current state is because someone previously took care of it.

The gun classifieds and auction sites are full of formerly collectible guns whose value is destroyed by an aftermarket scope, a reblue (even if done well), or some other permanent alteration.

Likewise, this also applies to some foreign models. There's one PAFOA poster "sporterizing" a rarer variant of Russian rifle, and posting his progress in a thread. Please don't do this.

What I would like to do:
1 - get it cleaned up - but I don't want to lose the patina as I'm pretty sure that is part of the overall value of the gun

You got it. Patina is synonymous for really valuable rust, when left undisturbed.

I would stop there. Frankly, I don't think I'd go much past oiling it, and maybe a oily patch down the bore.

[CliffB]

You might want to check with Doug Turnbull for expert advice. He is pretty much the best when it comes to 1911 restoration. He'll steer you straight on how to maintain value.
http://www.turnbullmfg.com/store.asp?pid=20791

[bigdawgbeav]

I was only considering getting it refinished if the gun had no real value. It seems like it inherently does. I don't plan on getting it refinished.

However, it still could use a professional cleaning. As this is part of history, I really don't want to be a slack-ass on this and need to take my time.

Using standard cleaners and oils won't be a detriment will it? I know the patina is the sought after part, but what about the internals being squeaky clean? I would think that clean internals would help the value.

[1blindref]

Take it to Classic Pistol in Southampton and let John Robinson detail strip and clean and lube the internals.

If you are interested in selling it, please send me a PM.