1-4x optics, DMS, PST, CMR, etc budget*

**Asmodeus6** · September 18th, 2011, 04:41 PM

I would like to start a discussion about these close to medium distance scopes that serve double duty as both magnified, and close range optics.

I have no experience with them. I have experience with your average 3-9x scope on a bolt action, Russian POSP stuff, a few red dot's and that's about it. Most of what I shoot is irons and well, my vision sucks. I was thinking something like this might be a good idea for me. I see these topics come up over and over so I wanted to put together a list of contenders here and have maybe some of the more experienced, or owners of these respective optics share some thoughts.

There is ONE rule however. This thread is price capped at $700. (scope only) I realize there is always a huge push for $2k glass on a $700 rifle. And I understand why. But I would never be able to utilize the benefits of one with anything I own, and I don't reload, or buy match ammo... etc.

So this is a budget oriented conversation about close / medium scopes. Particularly those with 1.X power / variable.

So far I have found the Millet DMS 1 to come up in nearly every one of these conversations. This is about a $200-250 option.

So let's start the list there.

Millet DMS-1 ($200-250) 1-4x / illum dot in a donut
[LINK]
Primary Arms 1-4x24 ($120) 1-4x / illum center dot
[LINK]
Burris TAC30 ($299) 1-4x24 / illum
[LINK]
Nikon M-223 1-4x20 / ($230) / no illum
[LINK]
Leupold VX-R 1.25-4x20 / ($399) / illum firedot
[LINK]
Leupold Mark AR 1-4x20 / ($269) / no illum / duplex
[LINK]
Vortex Viper PST 1-4x24 / ($499) / Illum TMCQ
[LINK]
Leatherwood CMR 1-4x24 / ($359) / Illum G circle dot
[LINK]
Falcon Menace 1.5-5x30 / ($245) / Illum LP20
[LINK]

This is probably just the surface of what is available out there now. The hot links I put in are to retail stores, optics planet, primary arms, and KIES firearms. I've shopped at all three so they should be safe.

Feel free to add or start discussion about any of the ones listed. I can always go back and edit the list, or include more or less detail.

**arjohnson** · September 18th, 2011, 05:01 PM

I have owned a Burris tac30 and currently own a Leupold VX-R 1.25x4 with the circle firedot reticle. I also liked both because they are 30mm, not a fan of 1" tubes.

The Tac30 is a great optic for the money, I liked the one I had as it was a true 1x. I should not have sold it, but oh well can always get another.

I currently have the VX-R on my LMT and I like it as well, only downfall is the 1.25 takes a little getting use to. I like the quality and for the price it's hard to beat. The dot is also visible in the day.

Here's a pic of my VX-R.

**The_War_Wagon** · September 18th, 2011, 05:33 PM

I've seen used Leupold Mk.IV C/QT scopes within your price range as well. It's a 1 - 3x14, and while I use it primarily for the 3x14 part on my PTR91, it does offer a close-range option. It's tubular form I think takes getting used to at close range, which is why I like it for longer range, but it's there if you need it!

**Asmodeus6** · September 18th, 2011, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by The_War_Wagon

I've seen used Leupold Mk.IV C/QT scopes within your price range as well. It's a 1 - 3x14, and while I use it primarily for the 3x14 part on my PTR91, it does offer a close-range option. It's tubular form I think takes getting used to at close range, which is why I like it for longer range, but it's there if you need it!

If you want to go into greater depth, photo's etc feel free. This one in on topic but just over in price. Although I was able to find some old ads for them under the $700 cap (new.) I would really like more magnification personally... and to shy away from the top end of the $ spectrum. But it may be helpful to other readers.

I'd kinda like to turn this into a 1-4ish wiki of sorts. So every contribution is appreciated.

**red dog** · September 18th, 2011, 08:03 PM

i just got the millett dms for my stag model three. paid 210.00 for it new. the glass is clear and the reticle is easy to see except for the 1 moa dot in the center. if i had to do it again i would go to a 3 or 4 moa dot as this type of scope is not really a target scope. the advertised ranging capabilities are worthless due to the fine lines of the retical. i have not used it much yet but it seems ok for the $. the illumination feature is so so at best, at the lower settings it would have to be fairly dark out. at the higher settings you do get some flair as is typical with most of these illluminated optics they make these days. happy shopping, remember you do not always get what you paid for but you have to pay for what you do get. red dog

**Asmodeus6** · September 18th, 2011, 08:27 PM

This is the reticle from the Falcon Menace 1.5-5x30IR

I think it would pick up pretty quickly at it's lower magnification given it's size.

Such as for use up close. If anything lit is on the target. Chances are you're going to hit it I would assume?

Anyone have any experience on this scope?

I'm personally leaning towards this, the leatherwood CMR, or MAYBE the vortex viper PST. I didn't want to spend $500 honestly. How awkward is 1.5x up close? Can it still be used both eyes open? (Effectively, not after months of training your eye to work to compensate.)