New Jersey and its regulations of action inside Pennsylvania

[39flathead]

I don't mean to run the thread off on some strange rant filled tangent, but if you choose to live in such a place, then you have also made the decision to abide by the draconian rules set into place there as well.

Yeah, Yeah, I know, it's hard to find a good paying job elsewhere, I have family there, etc, etc, etc....
Too bad.
Maybe what that place needs is a mass exodus leaving the state for someplace that values it's citizens lives.

Trying to find an end game around the laws in Jersey by using a PA shooting range is really not something that needs to be discussed here as it verges on illegal activity, IMO of course.

I do not live in Jersey, do not go there, do not spend any money there, as a matter of fact, I could care less about what kind of officials they elect there, because that is what this comes down to everywhere there are such laws, elections have consequences.

This thread has nothing to do with concealed carry.

[Statkowski]

New Jersey has already seen a mass exodus. Due to the high taxes imposed with the previous administration, some 900 million or billion dollars of assets (and the assets' owners) left the state for less onurous climes. The missing bodies were, of course, replaced, but by lower income types (i.e., not the filthy rich). The ones with the money had the money and voted with their feet.

[9orangeletters]

Could a mod move this to a more appropriate forum?

[Tequila Sunrise]

Could a mod move this to a more appropriate forum?

Why? It has everything to do with conceal carry. Because that's what you do when you're there. How about if a person doesn't like the thread he moves on? If the Mods think it should be moved they'll tell you.

[wa3ra]

I'd like to point out that if the NJ resident does not have a PA LTCF, he is still facing the exceptions here in PA at the moment...where CAN you carry a gun in your car without an LTCF?

[Curmudgeon]

I'd like to point out that if the NJ resident does not have a PA LTCF, he is still facing the exceptions here in PA at the moment...where CAN you carry a gun in your car without an LTCF?

Good point, thanks for bringing that up. When I get home from work and I'm sitting at a computer (instead of a cell phone) I will edit and correct my post.

[Greywolf]

I have a question regarding FOPA for New Jersey residents, with regards to their actions inside the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.

It's my understanding that New Jersey restricts the transport of firearms to unloaded, separate, locked and only directly to the range. It's also my understanding that the jurisdiction of the State of New Jersey ends at the Delaware River, and they have no ability to enforce or legislate any action within the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.

That being said, the "directly" in NJS 2C:39-6f(3)(b) is irrelevant once you cross over the Delaware. They're not able to govern, police or enforce your actions in another state.

I'm interested to know if I'm interpreting this correctly...

It would appear so, but what's really your question?

Any trip from NJ to PA involves interstate travel, which means that the FOPA becomes the operative law. The FOPA doesn't say anything about directly to a range. However, different people interpret the FOPA requirements in different ways. For example, according to some, when traveling under the FOPA you can't even stop to eat, drink or pee en route, let alone sleep. Personally, I maintain that, since the FOPA applies if I am driving from PA to WA and it's impossible to do that drive in less than three or four days (if you push hard), a reasonable person should conclude that the FOPA allows for bathroom breaks, meals "in the normal course of travel," and even sleeping in a motel near a highway interchange. It's when you detour 200 miles off the direct route to spend a weekend with Great Uncle Ned and Aunt Millie that you take yourself out of the zone of protection.

But I'm not sure that addresses your point. Are you asking if the trip into PA from NJ can be to a destination other than a shooting range?

On another note, you have to determine whether or not the FOPA actually can apply. Strictly speaking, the language of the FOPA says:

Sec. 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.

Note the section I bolded. "...where he may lawfully possess AND CARRY such firearm ..." So, irrespective of how attractive it is to see yourself as under the umbrella of the FOPA, unless you have a NJ carry license (or permit, whatever they theoretically issue in NJ), you can't claim FOPA protection for any interstate trip, even to a state where you CAN legally carry. The law clearly states that you must legally be able to possess AND CARRY at both ends of the journey.

So I think I agree with those who say that NJ can regulate the NJ portion of the trip, and that if the trip isn't to a range (even in PA), you aren't legal in transporting a firearm.

[xXxplosive]

So seeing that God can't even get a LTC in New Jersey, what about a Jersey resident whose a member of a PA range and also has a valid out of state LTC under PA Resaprocity.....like a Florida Lic.....?

Now What...............?

[tl_3237]

So seeing that God can't even get a LTC in New Jersey, what about a Jersey resident whose a member of a PA range and also has a valid out of state LTC under PA Resaprocity.....like a Florida Lic.....?

Now What...............?

For those portions of your range trip while within NJ:

On the outbound trip you must be going directly to a range; on your inbound leg you must be directly coming from a range.

Non-NJCCW licensure has no bearing. You are permitted reasonable deviations (fuel, sanitary facilities, food, etc) PROVIDED "the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances".

[tl_3237]

You need to go to and from the range but, do you need to shoot?

Yes - the gun must be intrinsic to the purpose of your travel.

for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions

NJS 2C:39-6f(3)(b).