Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Part-Time Resident

    Does anybody know the laws or have any experience with being a part-time resident. My primary residence is in NJ, but I go to my secondary residence that I own, on the weekends and holidays and vacations. Do I need to show NJ firearms ID card and can I only purchase long-guns? Can I purchase guns that are not legal in NJ, or that have an inappropriate magazine size as long I keep them in PA? If I am able to purchase guns as a resident in Pennsylvania, what is the law if I decide to bring them back to NJ? Or, vice versa... Would this be different if Pennsylvania was my primary residence, or if it was 50/50 of the time? What would the law be regarding private sales? Lastly, as a resident, what do I need to do? Does PA have a firearms ID card, like NJ, or a registry? Additionally, I am wondering if I would need to register any guns I buy and own in PA if I move to NJ....

    Please provide any information you can for me as a starting point on this.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    Quote Originally Posted by Oak_Patriot View Post
    Does anybody know the laws or have any experience with being a part-time resident. My primary residence is in NJ, but I go to my secondary residence that I own, on the weekends and holidays and vacations. Do I need to show NJ firearms ID card and can I only purchase long-guns?
    It is my understanding that in order to purchase long guns in Pa, Pa FFl's are supposed to sell according to the laws of your home state, which in this case would require your ID card. Some may not want to be bothered to sell them to you. You can purchase a handgun, but it must be shipped to a NJ FFL to complete the sale.

    Can I purchase guns that are not legal in NJ, or that have an inappropriate magazine size as long I keep them in PA?
    Yes

    If I am able to purchase guns as a resident in Pennsylvania, what is the law if I decide to bring them back to NJ? Or, vice versa... Would this be different if Pennsylvania was my primary residence, or if it was 50/50 of the time?
    As far as long guns purchased in Pa as a NJ res, and brought back to NJ,
    I'm not sure, but I don't believe you will have anything to worry about.

    Handguns purchased in Pa as a Pa res and brought to NJ, unless moving to NJ
    is likely illegal except for a few narrow exceptions.

    Anything purchased in NJ and brought to Pa as a result of a move there is nothing to do or be concerned with.

    In all cases fireams brought to NJ must be NJ compliant.

    Length of residency doesn't matter.

    What would the law be regarding private sales?
    Private sales of long guns between Pa residents is legal.

    Lastly, as a resident, what do I need to do? Does PA have a firearms ID card, like NJ, or a registry? Additionally, I am wondering if I would need to register any guns I buy and own in PA if I move to NJ....
    As a Pa resident nothing to do other than plunk down your money.
    No cards, no registration, no fuss.

    Again anything purchased in Pa while a Pa res. and brought to NJ, and I'm not 100% sure of this as who know's with NJ, so long as they are NJ compiant, ie mag caps, and not "assault weapons" I don't believe there is anything special you need to do.

    NJ doesn't have a registry, believe it or not.

    The only issue in Pa is with handguns as a NJ res.(or Pa) you can't just drive around with handgun in your vehicle, except to go directly to and from a point of sale, target practice, a gun smith or lawful hunting unless you have a ltcf or reciprocal equivalent.

    If your intention is to bring guns into Pa and leave them here I'm pretty sure you'll be OK, as a NJ res. The opposite, since you can only buy compliant long guns I don't believe NJ has an issue with it.

    If you think you will be moving to Pa for a short while and have to move back to NJ best just buy NJ compliant firearms, unless you are prepared to sell them or leave them somewhere safe.

    It sounds as though you are trying to play both sides of the fence though, and have dual residency.
    FUCK BIDEN

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    Quote Originally Posted by Oak_Patriot View Post
    Does anybody know the laws or have any experience with being a part-time resident.
    according to atf if you live part time in another state you are considered a resident of that state while you are residing there. so during that time you can go to freds guns in pittsburgh and buy a handgun. college students fall under this ruling as do snow birds and the guy who has an escape cottage in the mountains in the next state.

    the problem is convincing fred of this.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    You are considered a Pa resident for Federal firearm law purposes WHILE you are in occupancy of that Pa home under 27 CFR 478.11:

    State of residence. The State in which
    an individual resides. An individual resides
    in a State if he or she is present in a State
    with the intention of making a home in that
    State. If an individual is on active duty as a
    member of the Armed Forces, the individual's
    State of residence is the State in
    which his or her permanent duty station is
    located. An alien who is legally in the
    United States shall be considered to be a
    resident of a State only if the alien is residing
    in the State and has resided in the
    State for a period of at least 90 days prior
    to the date of sale or delivery of a firearm.
    The following are examples that illustrate
    this definition:
    Example 1. A maintains a home in
    State X. A travels to State Y on a hunting,
    fishing, business, or other type of trip. A
    does not become a resident of State Y by
    reason of such trip.
    Example 2. A is a U.S. citizen and
    maintains a home in State X and a home
    in State Y. A resides in State X except for
    weekends or the summer months of the
    year and in State Y for the weekends or
    the summer months of the year. During
    the time that A actually resides in State X,
    A is a resident of State X, and during the
    time that A actually resides in State Y, A is
    a resident of State Y.

    Dual residency can be a double edge sword IMO - any firearms bought as a Pa resident might have to stay at your Pa residence and not taken back to your NJ residence unless you are performing a bona fide move of household to NJ

    (18 USC 922(a)(3))
    (a) It shall be unlawful—
    (3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;
    As PaBimmerGuy said - you may have to find a coorporative FFL willing to do the purchase but it does appear to be legal.
    IANAL

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    This would seem to really only apply to handgun purchases (or purchases of long guns from private individuals). I would assume that there would be no problem transfering long guns between states, though. What is the rule regarding buying handguns or longguns from a private individual if the two parties are Pennsylvania residents?

    Some of the items that I want to purchase I know I couldn't bring into NJ because of magazine sizes, or because they are illegal in NJ. For example. I am interested in an FNX9 and an SR9. They don't make a 15-round magazine for the Ruger, so I would be stuck with a 10-round magazine, and the FNH doesn't even appear to make a 10-rounder at all. I would have to get an FNP with a 10-round magazine. So, it wouldn't be ideal, but I would be OK keeping them in two seperate locations.

    Besides, I think I can bring a gun into NJ temporarily (as long as it is legal there) as long as I have a valid NJ Firearms ID card.

    These laws need to be changed!

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    Quote Originally Posted by Oak_Patriot View Post
    This would seem to really only apply to handgun purchases (or purchases of long guns from private individuals). I would assume that there would be no problem transfering long guns between states, though. What is the rule regarding buying handguns or longguns from a private individual if the two parties are Pennsylvania residents?

    Assuming that the buyer is not otherwise disqualified (prohibited, age, etc), private transfer of longarms between Pa residents are perfectly legal. For handguns, unless the buyer and seller are related with 2 generations (antecedent or descendent) or spouse, then a PA FFL or sheriff must perform the transfer.

    Some of the items that I want to purchase I know I couldn't bring into NJ because of magazine sizes, or because they are illegal in NJ. For example. I am interested in an FNX9 and an SR9. They don't make a 15-round magazine for the Ruger, so I would be stuck with a 10-round magazine, and the FNH doesn't even appear to make a 10-rounder at all. I would have to get an FNP with a 10-round magazine. So, it wouldn't be ideal, but I would be OK keeping them in two seperate locations.

    Besides, I think I can bring a gun into NJ temporarily (as long as it is legal there) as long as I have a valid NJ Firearms ID card.

    The FOID card ONLY allows you to transport longarms into NJ. Possession in NJ of a handgun off your property requires either an NJCCW or qualification for an exemption under NJS 2C:39-6. The only exemption that you might qualify for, given the current info available in this thread, is the bona fide move from Pa to NJ. Just transporting back and forth between your Pa and NJ residences would not qualify.

    HOWEVER, irrespective of state laws, there is a potential violation of the Federal law (18 USC 922(A)(3) if your intent is to buy in Pa as a PA resident where its easier but relocate the weapons to your primary NJ residence. This applies to both longarms and handguns.


    These laws need to be changed!


    Blue inserts mine.
    Last edited by tl_3237; August 3rd, 2011 at 04:02 PM.
    IANAL

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    My thougts are not to make it easier, etc., but to actually get what I really want and at an affordable price. There is a much larger pool of used guns in Pennsylvania that would allow for a savings. Additionally, I would also like to purchase items that I want that are not NJ legal so that I have them, now, at a decent price, and to have for when I am ready to depart the blessed free State of NJ for good. I would also be able to perhaps modify magazines for items that I want, while in PA, and to then make them NJ acceptable.

    It seems that the growing trend is to make high cap items greater than 15-rounds for most new guns, and 9mms in particular. Unless they offer a 10-round California setup, NJ doesn't allow me to purchase these new items and severly limits my options.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    My suggestion, other than just moving the hell out of NJ, is to switch your residence to Pa by whatever means necessary. Make your purchases in Pa and keep them safely locked away in your Pa home. It’s nearly impossible to enjoy firearms in NJ anyway.
    Keep a few long guns in your NJ home that are compliant if you feel the need. Provided you own the NJ home I believe this would be legal provided you have a FID card. They would also be lawful to transport back and forth. You may need to reapply for your FID as a non res. I’m not sure.

    Assuming this is plausible it’s the only safe option I see other than chucking NJ the finger and moving.
    FUCK BIDEN

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    Quote Originally Posted by God's Country View Post
    NJ doesn't have a registry, believe it or not.

    The only issue in Pa is with handguns as a NJ res.(or Pa) you can't just drive around with handgun in your vehicle, except to go directly to and from a point of sale, target practice, a gun smith or lawful hunting unless you have a ltcf or reciprocal equivalent..
    NJ has a voluntary registration...

    Unless you have a LTCF -OR- a Sportmens Permit the only way you an hunt w/ a firearm is to open carry from your house -or- after transporting it to your vacation home. You can't drive from home or camp to hunt; it is not an exception to transporting w/ our a license.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Part-Time Resident

    Quote Originally Posted by wis bang View Post
    NJ has a voluntary registration...
    LOL that figures.


    Unless you have a LTCF -OR- a Sportmens Permit the only way you an hunt w/ a firearm is to open carry from your house -or- after transporting it to your vacation home. You can't drive from home or camp to hunt; it is not an exception to transporting w/ our a license
    Actually I'm wrong.
    Last edited by God's Country; August 5th, 2011 at 02:18 PM.
    FUCK BIDEN

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