NFA Trust Lawyer Recommendations?

[JonEMTP]

Hi All,

I'm thinking of jumping into the NFA world with both feet... probably SBR and a can in short order. Looking at doing a NFA Trust with other family members for flexibility of possession.

Anyway, I'm looking for a good attorney in the Phialdelphia area that folks here have had experience with.

I know of 2 on the forum (GunLawyer001 and Joshua Prince), and I'm sure there are others. Anyone have any recommendations?

Thanks,

Jon

[bac0nfat]

http://www.princelaw.com/Bio/JoshuaPrince.asp

I am very happy with the service he provided. There was one time that I had a question about my trust and he was outside of the office, so the receptionist had him call me on his cell phone. That's pretty much unheard of for a lawyer to do that unless they are getting paid for it.

[ithinkimamedic]

I will second Bac0nfat's recommendation of Joshua Prince. I've never heard a bad thing about him business wise and he has been an advocate for the NFA community for quite a while now.

[Nate7667]

Yep, Joshua is the guy to see.

[mike_g]

Prince should be the King!

[bac0nfat]

http://www.princelaw.com/Bio/JoshuaPrince.asp

I will second Bac0nfat's recommendation of Joshua Prince.

Yep, Joshua is the guy to see.

Prince should be the King!

So, I guess that pretty much answers your question OP?

[JonEMTP]

So, I guess that pretty much answers your question OP?

Pretty much. I've got a phone call with him scheduled this afternoon. Given the amount of positive feedback that I've seen for him here, and I haven't found any negative comments, it looks like he'll be getting my business.

Of course, I could also go with the local law firm that my father suggest I ask... they offered to have me pay them, while they verified that there was such a vehicle as a NFA trust, and then draw one up for me. At least another law firm I spoke with said they couldn't do it... but to talk to Joshua Prince.

Well, I'll let you folks know how it goes!

[bac0nfat]

Pretty much. I've got a phone call with him scheduled this afternoon. Given the amount of positive feedback that I've seen for him here, and I haven't found any negative comments, it looks like he'll be getting my business.

Of course, I could also go with the local law firm that my father suggest I ask... they offered to have me pay them, while they verified that there was such a vehicle as a NFA trust, and then draw one up for me. At least another law firm I spoke with said they couldn't do it... but to talk to Joshua Prince.

Well, I'll let you folks know how it goes!

I would STRONGLY recommend against using any lawyer for a gun trust who is not extremely familiar and experienced with NFA laws. If a lawyer has to verify that NFA trusts even exist, then they are not qualified to draft one.

There have been people who had Form 1's and Form 4's (with Trusts) approved by the ATF, only to have them revoked years later due to improperly drafted trusts. Granted, most (if not all) of those cases were with people who made their own trusts with programs like Quicken.

There are many NFA-specific issues that need to be addressed in your gun trust, that would be omitted in a typical trust. By hiring a lawyer who is already familiar with those issues, you know you will have your bases covered should any run-in with the law occur.

Also consider the fact that a lawyer like Joshua Prince has done so many gun trusts already, that it will be a MUCH faster process. So not only will you get your NFA toys faster, but it will also be much CHEAPER because lawyers charge by the hour.

[JonEMTP]

Trust me... we are on the same page there. The lawyer is telling me he's a firearms enthusiast, but he's never heard of a NFA trust... SMH. I just had to post it to vent.

[GunLawyer001]

I. . .
There have been people who had Form 1's and Form 4's (with Trusts) approved by the ATF, only to have them revoked years later due to improperly drafted trusts. Granted, most (if not all) of those cases were with people who made their own trusts with programs like Quicken.
. . . .

I could not let that comment pass without correction.

I'm only aware of one such claim. I made a post on Subguns some years back, it would have been in 2009 when Joshua was studying for the Bar exam, where I publicly expressed my fears that an improperly drafted Trust COULD be approved for a tax stamp, then later be challenged and found to be invalid, and any firearms registered to it would become contraband. My advice was that I didn't think that NFA trusts were a good idea in general, but if you insisted on using one instead of a corp or LLC, then have one prepared by an experienced attorney.

Shortly after that, an anonymous post from an IP that tracked to the Widener Law School appeared on Subguns, on Friday morning leading into a major holiday weekend; it was either Labor Day or Memorial Day, I forget which. This post made the claim that the situation I hypothesized had in fact now happened, that the anon poster was a person with a Quicken trust, and he had just had been told by ATF that all prior transfers to that trust were now invalid, based on a casual review of the trust documents made while processing a new Form 4. The anonymous poster asked for advice.

Within an hour or two, Mr. Prince responded on Subguns, coincidentally from the exact same IP address at Widener, offering to help. Shortly after that, he stated that the anonymous poster had an appointment with his father's law firm later Friday evening of this holiday weekend.

By Sunday of this holiday weekend, the originator of the national franchise system of NFA trusts, David Goldman (admitted to the Florida Bar in 2007), was reporting that sometime between Friday evening and Sunday morning, the trust had been reviewed and revised by the Prince Law Offices to the satisfaction of unnamed ATF agents, who apparently declined to spend the holiday with their families so that they could review trust document revisions.

This episode could be taken as validation of the idea that anyone wanting an NFA trust should hire someone with a lot of experience with NFA trusts, and it might tend to promote the business of any national NFA gun trust sellers. If it were true and verifiable. Unfortunately, nobody at ATF seems to have knowledge of this, it's never been reported by anyone else, and it's inconsistent with what Federal employees tend to do on holiday weekends.

Other than this single reported claim, I am unaware of any claims of trusts being found invalid and tax stamps revoked. I mention this because I was there when this arose on Subguns, and I'd like to keep PAFOA equally free of unverifiable rumors.

If there are any verifiable incidents, I'd be pleased to hear of them. Otherwise, I'd suggest that you be cautious.