Revealing LTCF info. w/ LEOs -- A Newbie needs help.

[Tyro Snapper]

Hello all!

First post on the forum, although I've been browsing for a few months now. I just recently acquired a LTCF from Blair Co. (much easier than I'd imagined) and now I've got a few questions. My father asked me earlier this evening if I knew the process regarding the off-chance I would be stopped by a LEO while I was carrying (my dad's question was in reference to driving a vehicle) - what information I should disclose to the officer, if any, and how would I go about it? And to be honest with ya'll, I thought I knew, but after reading a few posts about the subject on here, I am a little confused.

I just automatically assumed the correct and right thing to do would be to immediately inform the officer I have a LTFC (while having both hands on the steering wheel, or if on foot, my hands clearly visible and away from body) and state that I am carrying a firearm. I had assumed, since I'm not a criminal, won't be doing anything illegal, and have a legal license, I should be in the free & clear. Would this typically be the case? My demeanor and attitude towards people is constantly positive and non-threatening (I work in the hospitality industry) - so as I play the possible scenario in my head, I'm thinking that's the right course - but as I've read on here some posters feel that's not my obligation to reveal that information.

So what's up? I don't want any headaches when dealing with a situation like this, and stopping short of bending over and pulling down my pants for the officer, how can I come away with a positive experience? Any help or feedback would be greatly appreciated - I've read some other member's experiences with this, and it's just left me scratching my head even more.

Thanks!!

[mauser]

You aren't obligated to volunteer that information in PA. I've been stopped a few times and the subject has never been mentioned. If I'm not asked I'm not going to volunteer the information. I always carry, usually concealed but sometimes openly. The times I've been stopped by the police I was carrying concealed, he didn't ask and I didn't tell. I've heard too many anecdotes of someone informing the officer then having their firearm taken from them, handled, unloaded, inspected, serial number checked and whatever else they might do before they give it back. I'm usually in a bit of a hurry and don't have time for that nonsense so I just keep my mouth shut.

ETA:
Welcome to PAFOA!

[GunLawyer001]

It's a bit counter-intuitive, but being polite and notifying officers that you have an LTCF and are armed, will sometimes get you treated like a felony stop. Some cops pull guns and you end up face-down on the hood or the road. Not most cops. Just some. And the ones who will react badly are not required to wear special pointy blue hats, so you can't tell ahead of time how any particular officer will react to your disclosure.

A MUCH larger percentage of cops will simply respond by seizing your gun, without a warrant and without any special circumstances that warrant the seizure of your property. I know, it sounds stupid, because violent & desperate gangbangers are unlikely to
(a) possess a valid LTCF,
(b) tell cops that they are violating the law, and
(c) lose the advantage of surprise if they planned to attack the cop.

Regardless of logic, a lot of them will take your gun if they find out about it. Once they have it, they will run a search of the make.model/SN to see if it's stolen. Then they'll run it against the Record of Sale Database, under the mistaken belief that Pennsylvania has handgun registration, and if it's not "registered" to you, you won't get it back.

There's no legal requirement in PA to disclose. And there may be a cost to disclosure. So the smart money will not disclose.

[Tyro Snapper]

Umm... Wow ... I'm a little blown away by those answers, but considering I'm new to all of this and apparently a bit naive ... I dunno ... I guess I just automatically assumed being on the up & up would win me favor.

If that's how I should expect to be treated as a lawful citizen ... Whoa.

Thanks guys for the tips!

[F16vipers]

I don't want any headaches when dealing with a situation like this, and stopping short of bending over and pulling down my pants for the officer, how can I come away with a positive experience? Thanks!!

The easiest way is to avoid a headache is to not volunteer any information that isn't asked for. The majority of the time if your CC and doing it right most people (including officers) aren't going to know that you're armed.

That being said...if you believe for whatever reason you're in a situation where the officer might discover your firearm you may want to give him a heads up before he finds it. Just something to consider. When in doubt it's usually best just to keep your mouth shut

[bill gray]

Saw a very interesting video by Massad Ayoob re advising LEOs about carrying firearms. If you live in a State where you must advise, then do that but without saying scary words like "gun" or "firearm." He advised saying something like "I have a license to carry and I am. How do you want to proceed Officer?" In Penna you do not have to advise. But, if the firearm is in plain sight (maybe to the rookie coming up on the right side of the car), you might want to. Ditto if your are told to get out of the car and it will be discovered. Advising in those cases can take some of the drama out of the situation. Otherwise, play the odds and do not advise.

[soberbyker]

Don't answer anything not asked. Plain and simple.


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[bill gray]

A single LEO and you are CCing? I agree. But if the back up officer on the right is going to see and alert to the "GUN!!" or if you are told to get out of the car and a pat down is going to reveal that you are armed, then things change. You can reduce the stress level by not surprising the LEO in those situations. Let him/her hear a calm statement from a non-threatening posture. The LEO may become cautious but not panicked and that would be a good thing. There is no sense to not volunteering info that will become obvious in a few seconds.

[soberbyker]

A single LEO and you are CCing? I agree. But if the back up officer on the right is going to see and alert to the "GUN!!" or if you are told to get out of the car and a pat down is going to reveal that you are armed, then things change. You can reduce the stress level by not surprising the LEO in those situations. Let him/her hear a calm statement from a non-threatening posture. The LEO may become cautious but not panicked and that would be a good thing. There is no sense to not volunteering info that will become obvious in a few seconds.

Like everything in life you need assess the situation and weigh the pros and cons. In your scenario if you are OC then maybe I agree, but if CC I disagree.

As long as you don't act like you're doing something wrong then your encounter SHOULD go smooth.

IF asked if I had any firearms I would then offer the info I am licensed yada yada yada, however if asked if I had anything illegal I would say no sir.

I CC 98% of the time. OC is different as far as being found out goes.

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[headcase]

Like everything in life you need assess the situation and weigh the pros and cons. In your scenario if you are OC then maybe I agree, but if CC I disagree.

As long as you don't act like you're doing something wrong then your encounter SHOULD go smooth.

IF asked if I had any firearms I would then offer the info I am licensed yada yada yada, however if asked if I had anything illegal I would say no sir.

I CC 98% of the time. OC is different as far as being found out goes.

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Quoted for truth.