PICS Denial - Involuntary Mental Health Commitment

[jobo5432]

Hi there forum...

I'm in quite a bind. I recently attempted to purchase a new pistol and failed the instant check. Certain that the reason I was denied had to do with an incident in college, I submitted my challenge, included the police report, court dockets, and a detailed explanation of the situation and why any and all charges were dropped against me. I was confident I had been denied based on this incident and given the information I submitted, my challenge would hold it's water.

10 or so days following my sending the challenge paperwork to the PSP Challenge Unit, I received a confirmation of my denial and the reason cited was an involuntary mental health commitment in 1995. I was 17 at the time. Without going into all the details:

I was a foster child living with my foster parents at the time. A few days before my senior year of high school, I left my house, caught a bus to the local mall to buy a new alarm clock. I had been arguing with my foster parents, so I didn't tell them I left. I was gone three hours.

When I returned there was a Pittsburgh City cop at my house talking to my foster dad - not rare; he was a constable. I went to my room where the officer followed me up. Harassed me and cuffed me. The next stop was the mental health hospital. Apparently I had been reported as a runaway and despite my coming home note more than three hours later carrying only the same bookbag and a new alarm clock... the police took over the scene and made the decision to have me evaluated.

I didn't find out until later that my neighbor had lied and said I left the house with my "bags packed", when in reality I had a bookbag with a few CD's and a player... Nothing more. Cutting to the chase: My evaluation was NORMAL and my discharge required no additional care or medication or anything. It was a complete misunderstanding.

Once I found out why I had been denied my purchase, I started hunting down the record of my evaluation and discharge. Sadly though, Braddock Hospital here in Pittsburgh was purchased and summarily closed. When the hospital closed its doors, any record kept on microfiche (records up to 1999 - including mine) were permanently destroyed. As I was a foster child, I have a call in to the Children and Youth Services (now called CYF) and my old case worker to try and obtain as much information about that incident and my stay at the hospital as I can possibly get my hands on.

My questions to you fine folks are:

1. Should I be able to show that I was not diagnosed with any mental health disorder, do I stand at least a decent chance of having my challenge overturned?

2. If the records of my hospitalization were destroyed, where did the FBI/PSP get the information they used to deny me?

3. Since I don't have all my information together yet, if I fail to get a second challenge together before the PSP closes my challenge, how do I reopen it? Can I just walk into a dealer's shop and try to buy the gun again? How long do I have to wait if that's the case?

Thank you all so much for your input here. I'm very troubled by the whole process.... Being denied for something that happened when I was a minor, that never actually happened, having no clear path to obtain the records I need to show that I should be permitted to purchase and/or carry a firearm, and even more so, my lack of faith in the institutions of the state of Pennsylvania to see things the way they should see them and reverse my denial in the face of the proper proof.

-Jim

[CHEMICAL]

Wow...I would think that those records would be sealed....who knew. Good luck in your battle.

[jobo5432]

Wow...I would think that those records would be sealed....who knew. Good luck in your battle.

Thank you... Like I said: the thing affecting my mood on this issue is my lack of faith in the state to do the right thing. I've just had too faith-rattling run-ins with government to trust them.

[streaker69]

How did you answer question F on form 4473?

[jobo5432]

How did you answer question F on form 4473?

I answered truthfully.

Although I was never "adjudicated mentally defective (which includes having been adjudicated incompetent to manage your own
affairs)"...

I had to answer "Yes" because of the second part of the question: "have you ever been committed to a mental institution?"

When I received my challenge response from the PSP, however; they were able to pull dates from the hospitalization, so I was not denied solely on the basis of my "Yes" response. They had to do research and confirmed my denial, although those records have been destroyed as I found out this morning.

[chivvalry]

umm... get a lawyer?

[jobo5432]

umm... get a lawyer?

I have approached a lawyer and I will do what I have to however; it costs nothing to ask the informed people of PAFOA whereas lawyers charge retainer fees. Thanks for your valuable input.

[chivvalry]

I have approached a lawyer and I will do what I have to however; it costs nothing to ask the informed people of PAFOA whereas lawyers charge retainer fees. Thanks for your valuable input.

Heh, I really wasn't being snarky... That's the only advice I have to offer as I have never been denied nor do I personally know anyone that has.

[CHEMICAL]

Well if they were able to pull records....then records exist...including the analysis.

[jobo5432]

I don't know that what the PSP/FBI saw during my background check was anything more than an involuntary commitment in 1995. I doubt that the doctor's evaluation and discharge summary were present during the instant check or the slightly more thorough challenge investigation. I believe that if I can find those two pieces of information, I can show reasons why my denial should be reversed. My questions were more procedural like: If I were denied and I'm outside of the 30 day challenge period, what do I do to challenge the ruling a second time? Would it require a second purchase attempt? Is that even legal? If it's too early to try buying again, how long should I wait? etc... I have "top minds" working on getting the info I need to prove myself. I just don't know where to submit it and when once I have it.

@Chivvalry... I know you weren't being nasty or anything. It's just that I'm so frustrated. I have a second amendment right I have been told I am not fit to execute. I served my country (from 1996-2002). I had a rifle in my arms almost that entire time and when I get home, I'm told I'm not fit to purchase or own firearms. It's hypocritical. It's wrong, and I'm doing everything I can to fight this without resorting to the court systems.