carrying someone elses gun?

**cowboy13** · March 23rd, 2011, 09:28 PM

I know this question has probably been asked before, but i didnt feel like searching for it so ill ask again. In PA, what are the laws on carrying someone elses legally registered handgun if i have my concealed weapons permit?

**uniballin** · March 23rd, 2011, 09:37 PM

short answer: there is no registration in PA, so that point is moot.

since you have a license to carry firearms, other people can loan their firearms to you.

there is a gray area concerning the loaner and the returning of the firearm if the person doesn't have a LTCF of their own, but in my opinion, there is nothing to suggest in the laws that doing so would be illegal.

other, more knowledgeable people will chime in soon enough, but that's basically the answer you are looking for. take care and welcome to the boards.

**Statkowski** · March 23rd, 2011, 10:14 PM

You hit the nail right smack dab on the head.

There's no such thing as a "legally-registered handgun" in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. Other states may require registration thereof, but not this one.

There's no such thing as a "concealed weapons permit" in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. We do have a License to Carry Firearms (LTCF), which allows one to carry concealed, but it also allows other things otherwise prohibited by law.

One of which is - if you have an LTCF you can carry someone else's firearm (i.e., they can loan it to you).

**cowboy13** · March 23rd, 2011, 10:26 PM

first off, let me just say thank you for your timely replies. now as far as the ccw i realze my terminology may not have been completely accurate, but i was just trying to et the point across that i am legally able to carry a concealed firearm. as far as "no such thing as a "legally registered handgun"", im a bit confused. I know long guns are not registered, but are handguns not registered upon purchase to the purchasing individual? if thats the case buying and selling handguns off would require no paperwork? and so, say i sell my gun, and it gets sold off several other times without transferring ownership, and someone uses it to commit a crime would it not come back on me?

**uniballin** · March 23rd, 2011, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by cowboy13

first off, let me just say thank you for your timely replies. now as far as the ccw i realze my terminology may not have been completely accurate, but i was just trying to et the point across that i am legally able to carry a concealed firearm. as far as "no such thing as a "legally registered handgun"", im a bit confused. I know long guns are not registered, but are handguns not registered upon purchase to the purchasing individual? if thats the case buying and selling handguns off would require no paperwork? and so, say i sell my gun, and it gets sold off several other times without transferring ownership, and someone uses it to commit a crime would it not come back on me?

you are confusing the record of sales database with a firearm registry. the pennsylvania state police often use this record of sales database as an illegal, incomplete registry. all handgun transfers (except for a few scenarios such as between spouses and parent -> child) must go through a FFL (federal firearm licensee). the FFL will call the PSP and the buyer will undergo a background check through PICS (pennsylvania instant check system). if the buyer passes, a small fee is usually paid to the FFL for doing the transfer, and the transfer is complete. the gun is not registered to the person, but the state police now have a record that the transfer took place.

**CenterTree** · March 23rd, 2011, 10:35 PM

http://www.pafoa.org/law

Owning Firearms

1. Do I have to register my firearms in Pennsylvania?

No, in fact in Pennsylvania it is actually illegal for any government or police agency to keep a registry of firearms per 18 Pa.C.S. § 6111.4 (Registration of firearms). If you legally possess bring your firearms into the Pennsylvania or come into possession of the firearms legally, no further action is required.

It should be noted however that all transfers of handguns in Pennsylvania are required to go through the Pennsylvania Instant Check System (PICS) and as such the Pennsylvania State Police keep a "Sales Database" of all handguns purchased within the Commonwealth. While almost any casual observer can see that this database clearly violates the spirit of 18 Pa.C.S. § 6111.4 (Registration of firearms), in the Pennsylvania Supreme Court agreed with the Pennsylvania State Police that because the database is not a complete record of all handgun ownership (as people bringing handguns into the state do not have to register them), it does not.

**PA-Joe** · March 24th, 2011, 07:05 AM

Although you can legally do it you should also be prepared for the illegal taking of the firearm should you have a bad LEO experience. There are cases where firearms have been taking away from both a LTCF and FFL holders and held until ownership was confirmed.