.223 For Deer?

[keystoneman 85]

The 25-'06 a barrel eater??
I certainly hope not as with my Ruger #1 in this caliber I took two Maryland
"Beanfield" Deer, last year at 300+ yards and dropped both in their tracks.
Barrel shot out??
I think think that my Ruger # 1 is just getting "warmed up".
I love the cartridge,AND it is highly UNDERATED.
Game Hunting??
Pay close attention to Bullet Choice.

The 25-06 is my fav deer caliber. That being said the barrel on a 25-06 will wear out faster then that of a 30-06, 30-30, etc. But it's not like my gun will ever see it in it's life time. So to me its not a concern.

Note: My favorite deer rifle is my Marlin 30-30 since it was given to me by my grandfather at the age of 12 and has taken many many deer, including my best to date!

[yukon375]

i'm almost positive i read that for myself in the game laws back in the early 80's maybe someone out there has one of the little 3"x3" books from the 70's or 80's that could look it up???

Absolutely not.
Whoever told you that was giving you wrong information, or you misunderstood something.
Does anyone know where to find copies of the Pa. game laws from the 60s, 70s or 80s? If I'm wrong I'll retract my statement, apologize very humbly and buy you a burger & a beer. (or the beverage of your choice).
I started hunting in the 60s and all centerfire cartridges of any caliber were legal then, have been since then, and are now.

[mauser]

i'm almost positive i read that for myself in the game laws back in the early 80's maybe someone out there has one of the little 3"x3" books from the 70's or 80's that could look it up???

The oldest book I have is 1996 but a few quick Internet searches for "Pennsylvania Hunting and Trapping Regulations" and "Pa Game and Wildlife Code" turned up some results.
I'd still like to have a look at an actual booklet that was published 30 or 40 years ago. The wording in the 1996 booklet appears to have the same meaning but is worded considerably differently, I would presume for brevity.

Title 34 - GAME AND WILDLIFE CODE

Quick View The act of July 19, 1974 (P.L.486, No.175)

Enactment. Unless otherwise noted, the provisions of Title
34 were added July 8, 1986, P.L.442, No.93, effective July 1,
1987.

§ 2322. Prohibited devices and methods.
(a) General rule.--Except as otherwise provided in this
title or commission regulation, no person shall hunt, kill or
take or attempt, aid, abet, assist or conspire to hunt, kill or
take any big game, except wild turkey, with any of the following
devices or methods:
(1) Any device other than a centerfire or muzzle-loading
firearm or bow and arrow.
(2) Any automatic or semiautomatic firearm, except that
any semiautomatic firearm modified to permit one shell in the
chamber and no more than four shells in a magazine may be
used by a person who suffered an amputation or lost the total
use of one or both hands.
(3) Any firearm propelling more than one projectile per
discharge.
(4) Any projectile which is not all lead or which is not
designed to expand on contact.
(5) When any big game is swimming.
(6) By any other method or device which is not
specifically authorized or permitted by this title or
commission regulation.
(b) Penalty.--A violation of this section is a summary
offense of the fifth degree.
(c) Contraband.--Any big game killed contrary to this
section is contraband.

[Clark Kent]

Check out these rounds, hopefully come this fall I'll let you know how they do out of my AR (not in PA though).

http://www.ssarmory.com/556ammunitio...-leadfree.aspx

[mrat]

I thought the rules and regs stated ".25 caliber and smaller RIMFIRE prohibited".If it would be all,where does that leave .243 and 6mm? The energy of a .223 at 100yds is the same as a 30/30 at 200yds.Not that I've ever shot a deer at 200yds with a 30/30(longest was 100),I think with proper shot placement in heart/lung area at 100yds it'll work fine.I was witness to such a shot by a 13 yr old girl in WV. The bullet took out the top of his heart and he dropped like a bag of rocks.The reason she was using the .223 Rem. 700 was she had better accuracy than with her grandfather's .243 probably due to less recoil.If you can hit where you aim,the deer doesn't care if it was a .223 or .30-06 that killed him as long as he goes down.

[mauser]

Until someone can show me in black & white, I'll stand by my assertion that there is no, and in recent history has been no caliber restriction for Pa. big game as long as it's a centerfire cartridge. There is also no restriction on the caliber of rimfire either, .32 rimfire is just as illegal as .22 rimfire. I've never seen any restriction on anything smaller than .25 caliber, .24 caliber or anything remotely similar. The only restriction pertinent to this discussion prohibits rimfire cartridges and allows centerfire cartridges. It's been that way since I started hunting in 1968 and I don't know how long before that.
I'd think that common sense would dictate that even though .22 Hornet is centerfire and not illegal to hunt bear with you wouldn't want to use it for hunting bear. Not to say that it couldn't do the job but I certainly wouldn't want to be the one to attempt it.
Here's what's printed in the 1996 handbook, I haven't been able to come up with one older than that yet but I'm still looking.

[mrat]

mauser The reason I referenced the rimfire restriction was about the .25 min caliber.That came from the '86-'87 3X3 booklet.By '88-'89 it reads same as yours "single projectile,centerfire,expanding type only".I have older booklets from when I was younger('70s) but can't find them.I'm pretty sure they had the rimfire deal in that then also.At least it clears up the legality of the .223 today.

[Ithaca1937]

i'm almost positive i read that for myself in the game laws back in the early 80's maybe someone out there has one of the little 3"x3" books from the 70's or 80's that could look it up???

The oldest book I have is 1996 but a few quick Internet searches for "Pennsylvania Hunting and Trapping Regulations" and "Pa Game and Wildlife Code" turned up some results.
I'd still like to have a look at an actual booklet that was published 30 or 40 years ago. The wording in the 1996 booklet appears to have the same meaning but is worded considerably differently, I would presume for brevity.

I have the book for the 1970-1971 and 1971-1972 seasons. The guns and ammunition section from both are the same. Here is the front cover and page 14:

[mauser]

mauser The reason I referenced the rimfire restriction was about the .25 min caliber.That came from the '86-'87 3X3 booklet.By '88-'89 it reads same as yours "single projectile,centerfire,expanding type only".I have older booklets from when I was younger('70s) but can't find them.I'm pretty sure they had the rimfire deal in that then also.At least it clears up the legality of the .223 today.

Thank you mrat, that answers that. There was a caliber restriction, but only for rimfire. That means that if someone had a .44 Henry that they wanted to use for deer in PA. it would have been legal then but not now. I thought that all rimfire was always prohibited, I stand corrected. (That wasn't the original argument but I was mistaken in a different statement that I made). Fact is that .222, .223, .22 Hornet, etc. was legal then and is legal now.

I have the book for the 1970-1971 and 1971-1972 seasons. The guns and ammunition section from both are the same. Here is the front cover and page 14:

Thank you Ithaca1937, That's exactly what we were looking for. It shows what the restrictions were then and also shows where the misunderstanding comes from.
(BTW, good find, that book is almost twice as old as you are).

It's understandable that this misunderstanding exists, after all it was a few years ago (30 - 40) that people who actually read the booklet did read something about 25 caliber and smaller being prohibited.

Yukon375, I apologize for sounding harsh in my previous post, now I've just had my ass handed to me for what I said about rimfire calibers.

There is also no restriction on the caliber of rimfire either, .32 rimfire is just as illegal as .22 rimfire.

Karma is a bitch.

[Ithaca1937]

...

Thank you Ithaca1937, That's exactly what we were looking for. It shows what the restrictions were then and also shows where the misunderstanding comes from.
(BTW, good find, that book is almost twice as old as you are).

...

You're welcome. That book was in with my grandfathers hunting gear that I inherited, along with his Ithaca 37 of which my username came from.