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Thread: .223 For Deer?

  1. #11
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Quote Originally Posted by dkyser View Post
    I sometimes think it would be a good challenge, I know my Remington 7600 in .270 is a deer slayer, my favorite deer gun. I have also realized that when processing the deer later, shot placement is critical if you want to use all the meet. No shoulder shots for me, way too much meat thrown away.

    I know many like big calibers, and I can not imagine using anything larger than a .270, I feel many use too much rifle for the job.
    I use a 308 Win, and I think that's about right for big game hunting. I'd rather lose a tad more meat and have the deer drop dead right then and there than have it wander off. Tracking sucks.

    I've never really cared for 270 Win, it's an old cartridge and its performance can be equaled nowadays with modern powders in a short action. I think I'd pick up a 7mm-08 sooner than a 270. Next rifle will be a 260 Remington. Lots more bullet options (IMO) in 6.5mm, 7mm, and 7.62mm than 270/6.8mm.

  2. #12
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    I've killed many deer with a .222. My dad bought it for me as a graduation present so he could get his .243 back. When he tried the .222 himself he hunted with that more than the .243. He'd take the .243 when he thought he'd be making long shots but up to 300 yards the .222 was deadly.
    We butchered our own deer and made our own sausage, we saw first hand what the damage of the bigger calibers was. If you pay someone to process your deer and think they must be keeping some of the meat for themselves you could be wrong, they're just getting rid of what was ruined by poor shot placement, especially with larger calibers.
    I wouldn't shoot much more than 250 - 300 yards with a .222 or .223 but out to that distance with a well placed shot and the right load you have nothing to worry about.
    The only deer I ever shot with a .222 that needed more than 1 shot was my fault, I shot it in the neck instead of waiting for a better shot. It went about 200 yards and dropped but wasn't dead, I felt real bad about that.
    My longest kill with the triple deuce was about 300 yards, heart/lung shot, it was a true bang-flop. I touched the trigger and it dropped instantly. The heart and lungs were a gelatinous mess.
    The original post was asking about "in the hands of an experienced hunter", I'm adding that with the right load you have nothing to worry about.
    I don't know the powder charge right off hand but I do know that it was at or near maximum and the bullets we used were Sierra 52 grain Match King. They had plenty of penetration to get into the middle and plenty of expansion to do the required damage before the energy was depleted.
    You still have to be careful of shot placement, if you hit a bone you can ruin a lot of sausage meat with that 'bee stinger' (as my uncle called it).
    OK, I'm putting my flame suit on now,
    .22 Hornet will easily take a deer out to 150 yards or more but you do have to be more careful about shot placement, head or heart only. This isn't for a novice hunter.
    Magnum calibers leave a lot of wounded deer with poorly placed shots, possibly more than smaller calibers due to overconfidence of the shooter with the thinking that you only have to hit it somewhere to score a kill, especially a novice or someone impatient.
    It has more to do with the hunter than the gun, but getting back to answering the question posed by the OP, no, you aren't crazy for considering this, and if you are confident that you aren't going to take a shot that isn't a good shot (like so many big caliber hunters might be tempted to do), your .223 has plenty of killing power for what you want.
    Good luck, have fun, and enjoy more of your venison.

    I don't have a short temper, I just have a quick reaction to bullshit.

  3. #13
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Quote Originally Posted by offshorebear View Post
    If I'm remembering correctly, the bullet in TAP was designed as a varmint round. Its good at what it does, but I wouldn't count on it to punch through lots of bone and still have much velocity. There are plenty of big game 223 rounds out there, just use one of those.
    The 60gr TAP bullet is a V-Max bullet, with the ballistic tip, designed originally for varmint. The 75gr OTM version of TAP however, I don't think was designed for varmint. It's strictly made for use on our own kind... I could be wrong though.

    What .223 rounds are designed for big game? And why doesn't anybody consider them for self defense in AR's? I'm interested Good enough for big game means it's gotta be good enough for self defense. I thought all .223 rounds were designed specifically for self defense against humans, or varmint.

    I think a .223 would be good enough for a deer, but as most hunter's say, as long as the placement of the shot is perfect. Defiantly better choices out there. As I mentioned, deer are tough. People relating hunting rounds to self defense rounds based on deer being similar weight to a grown man. Deer get hit by cars at 40mph and sometimes run away. I'd like to see a human do that. Now saying a round good enough for a deer is good on a man is one thing, but saying a round is good enough for man means its good on deer is another. And then there are guys saying, .223 isn't good for deer it can't be good for self defense against people. I know I'm getting off topic here.... Sorry

  4. #14
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    It can be done with a .223 but its not an ethical round not a heavy enough bullet a .243 is a minimum in my book...coyote rouund yes...chuck round yes...self defense?...I guess still rather my .308 ar-15..people are going to disagree with me but why risk loosing a deer to a tiny round like that I'll buy you a box of 30-30 instead of seeing someone using a .223 to havrvest a deer and a .222 is illegal in PA I believe i'll find the citation as soon as can...I can understand in states where semi-auto deer hunting is legal but it isn't in PA so what's the point

  5. #15
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_NEPhila View Post
    Uhmmm... you do know that rimfire is illegal to harvest deer with in Pennsylvania, right? No one should put any value on the above statement, it is irresponsible, illegal and ignorant.

    Draw weight on a bow has little to no value, there are bows that are more efficient at storing and releasing energy at lower draw weights that produce a higher arrow speed. As for arrows, I would say they are more lethal than bullets especially the new mechanical broadheads. Having a 1.5 inch width cutting edge on an arrow will lacerate tons of internal goodies and lead to a quick and humane death for the deer.

    Using a .223 for deer is foolish, especially if you know better. As far as I know .223 would be legal in PA to hunt deer and it would also be a poor choice.

    As previously stated by an educated poster, blood loss or exsanguination is what kills most deer after being shot. There are only two ways to die from a gunshot wound for any living thing, bleeding to death or direct physical damage to the central nervous system. There is no magical force or "power" that kills or incapacitates.

    Deer are wonderful and delicious animals, respect them. We have something they do not, higher order cognitive functions. Think through your actions and show some respect for your quarry by making decisions to harvest them in the most humane and efficient manner.
    I should have prefaced my post by saying that I was culling, not hunting. I would not advocate violating game laws (even though Pa. is dominated by FUDDS) under any circumstances.
    As an example, I spent 15 or so days in the field this year and managed but a single medium sized doe (anterless in 5C).
    I stand by my comments on the killing power of .22 rf and 5.56mm when used properly.
    Crusader's local #556 South Central Asia chapter

  6. #16
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Before I put my 2 cents worth in I checked the Hunting Digest that you get with your hunting license and on page 31 under what is legal to hunt deer or bear with during regular season it states "Manually operated (pump, lever, bolt actions,single shot) centerfire rifles, shotguns and handguns (revolvers or single shot) with all lead bullet or ball, or a bullet designed to expand on impact." So although it's legal to use these sub-caliber rounds for hunting deer I personally wouldn't. I believe that a deer round starts at a 25 caliber. I know that a lot of people use the 24 caliber with great success but I like a little more oomph due my style of hunting. I still hunt and you don't always get that perfect broad side shot. I want a round that will get into the heart/lung area no matter what angle I shoot the deer from.

  7. #17
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Maybe not ideal but definitely doable, especially for someone with experience.

    Use the proper bullet (Barnes TSX, Nosler Partition, or the Win 64 gr PowerPoint), limit your yardage to 200, and go forth and slay deer.

    Dale

  8. #18
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Quote Originally Posted by EvoRich View Post
    The 60gr TAP bullet is a V-Max bullet, with the ballistic tip, designed originally for varmint. The 75gr OTM version of TAP however, I don't think was designed for varmint. It's strictly made for use on our own kind... I could be wrong though.

    What .223 rounds are designed for big game? And why doesn't anybody consider them for self defense in AR's? I'm interested Good enough for big game means it's gotta be good enough for self defense. I thought all .223 rounds were designed specifically for self defense against humans, or varmint.
    Federal Fusion in 223. http://www.fusionammo.com/ballistics/rifle.aspx?id=803

    I don't know if a self defense round has the same demands as a hunting round. I'm sure debates can be found on the internet.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    From what I've heard on this debate is the people that have not hunted with a .223 are horrified at the very thought, and the people that have hunted with .223 swear by it. I've talked to quite a few people that hunt with it, most of them older and switched to it because they couldn't handle the recoil of the larger caliber rifles they had used in the past, and they all have had similar stories; the deer dropped instantly or only walked a few feet from where it was shot. Granted these were seasoned hunters and were putting well placed shots into the vitals. They all said just make sure you use a good hunting round designed specifically for hunting deer.
    You called down the thunder, well now you've got it!

  10. #20
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    Default Re: .223 For Deer?

    Thanks guys, and I will not change my thinking that a deer 100-150 yards out would be an easy kill with a clean shot am also looking at other calibers.

    Looking at 25-06, 7mm 08 and 308.

    I reload so can load the load I want.
    Kimber Custom Covert II, Kimber Pro CDP II, Glock 21

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