Can you hunt with a Mosin-Nagant?

[dteed4094]

I believe you can't have the bayonet attached while hunting legally. But then who would want to.

[kunsunoke]

Sure can (might be overkill, in fact). As others have stated, power is equivalent to 30-06.

But you'll want to make sure you've got some accuracy first. Best way to do that is to handload.

Some barrels were larger than specification, due to wartime pressures and the need for "gun always to kill fascists" as Comrade Commissar would say. The solution is to use .311 or .312 bullets. Those can be had thanks to the efforts of Woodleigh, Sierra and Hornady.

I recommend the .312 Interloc RN soft-point by Hornady in 174-grain. With a 54-grain load of synthetic powder (IMR 4350) the muzzle velocity will be around 2700 ft/sec. Hits like a Mack truck.

And if you need more bullet, you can go for the Woodleigh in 215-grain at a reduced powder charge.

See what I mean about overkill?

[abner13]

I believe you can't have the bayonet attached while hunting legally. But then who would want to.

It has been said that the 91/30 Mosin sights are regulated to hit point of aim with the bayonet attached. Haven't tried it myself , but my results were about the same as several magazine test articles in hitting about a foot high and somewhat left without. When the mags attached the bayonet , the groups were pretty much centered.

[Tim Ault]

US commercial ammo is held to 55,000psi (62,000MAX) for .308 Win , 50,000psi (60,000MAX) for 30-06 , but I'm not sure about the 7.62x54R.
.

According to COW the 54R is 45K and as others have posted it also has a smaller case cap. Add the two together and you dont have anything that is slightly more powerful to the 30-06 no matter what the bullet weight is if you do a real apples to apples comparison ie: same barrel length ,loaded to established pressure limits ect. infact I just pulled out my Accurate Arms manual with a 180 gr bullets both with 24 " barrels the 06 bests the 54R by 200+ fps. with the 150 gr again the 06 wins by 300 + fps.

Will they both kill a measley deer of course ,but the 54R is not more powerful even slighty than the 30-06 in a fair comparison.

[abner13]

If ya have Barnes COTW , go to the military rifle cartridges and compare the issue WWII rounds and you'll see that in military loadings , they are as I originally stated.

While yer at it , check the German WWII 8mm Mauser. It also beats the -06 in issued military loadings. A 154gr spitzer at 2800fps or so. Then check current sporting ammo. It's barely above 30-30 levels.

For whatever reasons , SAAMI and US ammo makers hold forgien military rounds to a very low pressure standard. Reloading data is likewise held low. Yet German Model 98 Mausers and Russian Mosin-Nagants have both proven much stronger than the US 1903 Springfield. The US 1917 "Enfield' was a different creature. It was immensely strong and used for many potent wildcats and magnum rounds.

Older copies of P.O.Ackley's Handbook for Shooters and Reloaders have a slightly different take on things. But then , shooting and reloading men of that era knew their limits and didn't hold everyone else liable for their actions.

[thefirstndsecond]

Yea you can use a moisen - neg.

YA know how the "shooters" call hunters who don't carry or don't understand carrying fudds....


Well what do hunters call people who use military surplus rifles to hunt game?

hahahahahahhaaaaa

City folk!!!!!!! Closet members of PETA....

Sure you can hunt with it, but I love my conditioned, handed down, scoped, 700.

Then there's the old iron sight 35.

Wars over man, Wormer dropped the big one.

Merry Christmas and I hope ya get a nice clean, hunting rifle. Spend a little, hand it down to the child you teach to hunt.

*Fudd is a terrible term for people. A label created by the anti hunting establishment to get the general public to believe all hunters are stupid and hunting is stupid. TRY to remember not to use the term. It hurts.

[Hawk]

FPS at muzzle is only part of the equation when it comes to "power". IMHO, the velocity along with kinetic energy at range is more of a determining factor of power.

The original claim was that "the 7.62x54R was more powerful than the 30.06". In the context of the original topic, this statement was really claiming the Mosin Nagant rifle is more powerful than a typical 30.06 hunting rifle. All of the previously posted info really doesn't apply. Take the MN to the field with military surplus ammo along with any modern 30.06 hunting rifle with factory ammo and see what the FPS and Energy are at range.

BTW, there is a big difference in ballistics (same round) between the various types of MN (M91/30, M91 Finnish, M91 Russian) Not even including the carbines.

[abner13]

FPS at muzzle is only part of the equation when it comes to "power". IMHO, the velocity along with kinetic energy at range is more of a determining factor of power.

The original claim was that "the 7.62x54R was more powerful than the 30.06". In the context of the original topic, this statement was really claiming the Mosin Nagant rifle is more powerful than a typical 30.06 hunting rifle. All of the previously posted info really doesn't apply. Take the MN to the field with military surplus ammo along with any modern 30.06 hunting rifle with factory ammo and see what the FPS and Energy are at range.

BTW, there is a big difference in ballistics (same round) between the various types of MN (M91/30, M91 Finnish, M91 Russian) Not even including the carbines.

Tried for a discussion , not an argument. If ya take 3 .30cal bullets of equal weight and same shape and construction and drive them at the same terminal velocity , they both have the same 'power' when they hit , whether they are fired from a 30-06 , 7.62 Russian or .308 Win. I know people with Finnish Mosins , which are frequently fitted with .308 groove dia barrels , who simply take surplus ammo , pull the bullets , resize the necks and replace the powder charge and seat a 150gr pointed soft point , hunting bullet.

Comparing a 150gr FMJ and a 150gr PSP is like comparing apples and eggs. Yes , if both are driven to , say , 2800fps , they will have the same terminal ENERGY , but due to the expanding of the soft point , that bullet has better KILLING power. No ethical hunter would use FMJ bullets for hunting , unless it on smaller critters harvested for pelts , where ya don't want a big hole.

And yes , as I've been reloading the 30-06 for over 30 years , I know that with modern powders , I can put together handloads for it that will beat any listed .308 or 7.62 Russian load.

PS/BTW/FWIW , yes , I'd bet that most , if not any surplus Czech or Russian light ball (147gr FMJBT) round is faster than any 150gr commercial sporting load. Frequent listing in the magazines show that most commercial ammo rarely lives up to published velocity when fired over the chrono screens.

[Hawk]

Tried for a discussion , not an argument. If ya take 3 .30cal bullets of equal weight and same shape and construction and drive them at the same terminal velocity , they both have the same 'power' when they hit , whether they are fired from a 30-06 , 7.62 Russian or .308 Win.

Physics says thats true. But you just made my point. We are not really comparing the same round out of the same gun now are we? If you take two different rifles shooting two different rounds and you only measure the velocity at the muzzle, it won't tell you which has more power solely by that measurement. There are really two factors that will determine the power (beyond the muzzle) if all else is equal. One is the ammo, the other is the design of the barrel. We haven't even factored in accuracy. Sure it's possible to custom load a 7.62x54R to shoot "faster" than a typical 30.06 round at the muzzle, but how fast the energy bleeds off and how much the round deviates from it's trajectory at 200+ yards compared to the 30.06 round would be the true measurement of performance. BTW, I'm a fan of surplus military rifles. I own and shoot a 1903A3 & a M1917. I've owned a Mosin Nagant for about 2 month's. I was curious. I was sorely disappointed in it's performance as compared to my 30.06's. I'm not soured by my experience, someday I'd like to get my hands on another (this time, one I can test drive before I buy).

[knight0334]

I believe you can't have the bayonet attached while hunting legally. But then who would want to.

There is no law or regulation against that.