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December 13th, 2010, 03:17 AM #1Senior Member
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I live within 1000 feet of a school....
According to the posting here of where I can't carry in PA it lists within 1000 feet of a school. Since my property is within that distance does this mean I can not carry on my property or on the public sidewalk in front of my house?
I would need to put my gun on after I drive down the street?
Can someone help me clarify this?
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December 13th, 2010, 03:51 AM #2
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December 13th, 2010, 04:00 AM #3
Re: I live within 1000 feet of a school....
Brudog, do you have your Pennsylvania LTCF? I need to know, it makes a big difference.
Edit: OK, I'll try to answer the question either way.
It is a violation of the Gun free School Zone Act of 1995 to be within 1000 feet of the property line of a K-12 school unless you fall under certain exceptions.
Here are the exceptions I believe are most relevant to your situation...
(B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—
(i) on private property not part of school grounds;
(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
(iii) that is— (I) not loaded; and (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
The GFSZ Act is a Federal law. The 1000 foot issue is not PA law. PA statutes say you should not be on school grounds.
So, if you are on private property, or have your LTCF, or have your firearm unloaded and locked up in your car, you are OK.
Make sense?
Edit #2. Brudog, it should be noted that your question is answered in the stickies section at the top of the Concealed and Open carry section of this forum: http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-ope...nsylvania.html If you look at item 2b in the first post you will find all this information, although you would have had to click the link for the GFSZ Act and read it.Last edited by Curmudgeon; December 13th, 2010 at 04:36 AM.
While many claim to support the right, precious few support the practice.
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December 13th, 2010, 04:16 AM #4Banned
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Re: I live within 1000 feet of a school....
(emphasis added)
No.
18 USC 922(q) contains the Gun Free School Zone Act offenses. It also professes the alleged legislative findings/intent:
(q)(1) The Congress finds and declares that—(I) the Congress has the power, under the interstate commerce clause and other provisions of the Constitution, to enact measures to ensure the integrity and safety of the Nation’s schools by enactment of this subsection.
Let the hilarity begin. (The Constitution really isn't too large to not be able to quote all the provisions giving power, especially the main little section called Article I, Section 8 that enumerates the powers of Congress...)
18 USC 922(q)(2)(A) states that "It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone."
However, 922(q)(2)(B) states in part:
Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—
(i) on private property not part of school grounds;
(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
(iii) that is—
(I) not loaded; and
(II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
The definitions that bring us around to school property + 1000 feet are at 18 USC 921:
(a) As used in this chapter—.
(25) The term “school zone” means—
(A) in, or on the grounds of, a public, parochial or private school; or
(B) within a distance of 1,000 feet from the grounds of a public, parochial or private school.
(26) The term “school” means a school which provides elementary or secondary education, as determined under State law.
And there are other definitions of use in § 921.
I think a 1/5th mile self-defense-free zone around a school is bullshit, and if I lived in that 1000 feet I'd consider suit because it's untenable disarmament. Of course, it's as untenable for people passing through, but those who live within that range, especially when the homestead was erected before the school was, probably have the best standing and the best sob story through which to advance their challenge.
See how egregious this can become with a patchwork of schools:
http://www.gunlaws.com/Gun_Free_School_Zones.htm
Now think about how the government could make rectangles with schools as borders so that gun carriers would have to disarm and rearm every 5 miles (for example), or the government could make a patchwork of schools so dense that no one could carry a loaded firearm without a license from that particular state. It's disgusting.
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December 13th, 2010, 05:10 AM #5
Re: I live within 1000 feet of a school....
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December 13th, 2010, 05:17 AM #6
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December 13th, 2010, 05:32 AM #7
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December 13th, 2010, 05:46 AM #8
Re: I live within 1000 feet of a school....
Right, got that.
Correct.
Right. It is not going to say LTCF because it is a federal law and applies to licenses/permits in all states.
In your #2, you suggest that the 1000-foot rule/law only applies to illegal carry. It does not. The 1000-foot rule also applies to legal carry by "any individual". If you do not have your LTCF and choose to walk out of your house while Open Carry, and proceed to walk down the street, you must avoid the GFSZ, see? You are legally carrying, and the law also applies to you, not just to those who are carrying illegally.
Make sense?
.While many claim to support the right, precious few support the practice.
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December 13th, 2010, 06:18 AM #9
Re: I live within 1000 feet of a school....
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December 13th, 2010, 06:36 AM #10Grand Member
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