Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default "Triple A for 2A" - JPFO - Retain a Lawyer for $99/year

    I get JPFO (Jews for the Preservation of Firearm Ownership) emails although I am not a member. This email came a few days ago. Basically they are advertising a company called Slate and Jones which is lawyers which specialize in gun cases. You can retain them for $99 per year - a kind of insurance:

    "What help would you have if you were unfortunate enough to be involved in a legitimate self defense shooting? Even worse, what would you do if it occurred on a Friday evening? Do you struggle through best you can with law enforcement and jail until you (perhaps) find an attorney on the following Monday? There is way too much at stake and so your best option is to be prepared, which is why JPFO is happy to promote the services of Slate & Jones, a legal service to ensure that for a modest annual sum ($99) you can have rapid help at hand."

    I am not pushing this, just informing - read about it for yourself here:

    http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z2/slate-jones.htm

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    retired to Eastern, Tennessee
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    Default Re: "Triple A for 2A" - JPFO - Retain a Lawyer for $99/year

    This coverage provides "Emergency" representation after a self defense incident. It does not cover representation for a criminal or civil trial if things go that far. Though they claim that coverage is available in most states (including Pennsylvania) it doesn't say how many attorneys are in the program or where they are.

    The Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network (ACLDN) (http://www.armedcitizensnetwork.org) offers something similar ("Boots on the Ground") for $85 and half of the membership funds a foundation that can be used to aid in the trial phase. It's worth looking into if you're interested in coverage of this kind.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: "Triple A for 2A" - JPFO - Retain a Lawyer for $99/year

    Relative to DON'T TALK TO THE COPS!
    (I added the BOLDing below )

    From the above mentioned link...


    Ayoob:
    But now, let’s look at the reality of it: the advice to shut up comes from attorneys who are defending men that they know, number one, lie to everybody, and may well have lied to them. You were there when I asked the two attorneys in our LFI I class, “How many times have you been lied to by your clients?” and they both burst out laughing, and, of course, both have long since lost count.

    Anything that a guilty man says is either going to be inculpatory and guarantee his conviction and defeat the purpose of the criminal defense attorney, or it will be perjury and if endorsed by the attorney could theoretically have him disbarred and convicted of the felony of subornation of perjury. So obviously, they learn to tell their clients, “Shut up, Shut Up, SHUT UP! You’re a guilty son of a bitch, you can’t talk your way out of it.” And that’s the story. [Sighs]

    With the innocent, it is entirely different. The truth is what sets you free. The truth is not going to change. We need to get that truth out immediately, so those who might accuse us will know that from the beginning we never changed our story. If we don’t do that at the beginning, it looks consciously or subconsciously, like what we’re saying is some bullshit that our defense lawyer and his hired gun expert witnesses came up with to bamboozle the jury.

    eJournal: But there are limits…

    Ayoob: Certainly, we should not spill our guts at the scene. The involved victim of the near-death experience will experience distorted perceptions: you’ll not be able to keep count of your shots, and the attacker may appear to be closer and larger than he was. Answers to questions like, “Exactly what words did he say before you shot him?

    Exactly how many shots did you fire? Exactly how far was he in feet and inches and how many centimeters long was his knife?” will invariably be wrong. To people who’ve never been in that situation, it will look as if you are lying or exaggerating.

    You do need to establish at the scene that you were the intended victim; he was the perpetrator. You need to establish at the scene that you are the complainant and he is the perpetrator and suspect. You need to point out the evidence before it disappears. Spent cases get picked up in shoe treads, and I’ve seen them literally blown away in the wind. You need to point out the witnesses. You tell the truth of what happened before they decide, “We don’t want to get involved,” and walk away. And then, you need the self-discipline to say, “Officer, you know how serious this is, you’ll have my full cooperation, after I’ve spoken with counsel.” And stick to that.

    eJournal: And this happens between you and the responding officers, because your attorney can’t roll in with a blue light on top of his or her car and be there right after the shooting?

    eJournal: So the armed citizen gets through the initial police response; now their lawyer is present. How do they keep that lawyer on the right track? What can they do if their lawyer goes off point, maybe they want to plead out, for example?

    Ayoob: First, if the guy says, “Plead to something,” when you’ve done nothing wrong, fire him now! He does not understand how to defend innocent people; that is the strategy of the guilty man’s lawyer. My experience has been that a guilty man’s lawyer who gives you a guilty man’s defense, will get you a guilty man’s verdict.

    When in doubt, call the Network. We’ll find someone for you.

    eJournal: So don’t try to salvage that lawyer?

    Ayoob: You’ve done the right thing! Don’t plead because the guy tells you to plead because it is going to be easier for him and cheaper for you! Is it going to be cheaper for you to be a convicted felon for the rest of your life, unable to protect your family, unable to get the kinds of jobs to earn the living that you might have earned otherwise? That does not strike me as victory. It’s the kind of thing that people do when they’re terrified of things they don’t understand and they are, in essence, being blackmailed by the other side’s threats.
    Read the full article HERE
    And others HERE

    ID
    Last edited by ImminentDanger; October 27th, 2010 at 11:15 PM.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: "Triple A for 2A" - JPFO - Retain a Lawyer for $99/year

    Quote Originally Posted by ImminentDanger View Post


    Quote:
    Ayoob:
    But now, let’s look at the reality of it: the advice to shut up comes from attorneys who are defending men that they know, number one, lie to everybody, and may well have lied to them. You were there when I asked the two attorneys in our LFI I class, “How many times have you been lied to by your clients?” and they both burst out laughing, and, of course, both have long since lost count.

    Anything that a guilty man says is either going to be inculpatory and guarantee his conviction and defeat the purpose of the criminal defense attorney, or it will be perjury and if endorsed by the attorney could theoretically have him disbarred and convicted of the felony of subornation of perjury. So obviously, they learn to tell their clients, “Shut up, Shut Up, SHUT UP! You’re a guilty son of a bitch, you can’t talk your way out of it.” And that’s the story. [Sighs]

    With the innocent, it is entirely different. The truth is what sets you free. The truth is not going to change. We need to get that truth out immediately, so those who might accuse us will know that from the beginning we never changed our story. If we don’t do that at the beginning, it looks consciously or subconsciously, like what we’re saying is some bullshit that our defense lawyer and his hired gun expert witnesses came up with to bamboozle the jury.

    eJournal: But there are limits…

    Ayoob: Certainly, we should not spill our guts at the scene. The involved victim of the near-death experience will experience distorted perceptions: you’ll not be able to keep count of your shots, and the attacker may appear to be closer and larger than he was. Answers to questions like, “Exactly what words did he say before you shot him?

    Exactly how many shots did you fire? Exactly how far was he in feet and inches and how many centimeters long was his knife?” will invariably be wrong. To people who’ve never been in that situation, it will look as if you are lying or exaggerating.

    You do need to establish at the scene that you were the intended victim; he was the perpetrator. You need to establish at the scene that you are the complainant and he is the perpetrator and suspect. You need to point out the evidence before it disappears. Spent cases get picked up in shoe treads, and I’ve seen them literally blown away in the wind. You need to point out the witnesses. You tell the truth of what happened before they decide, “We don’t want to get involved,” and walk away. And then, you need the self-discipline to say, “Officer, you know how serious this is, you’ll have my full cooperation, after I’ve spoken with counsel.” And stick to that.

    eJournal: And this happens between you and the responding officers, because your attorney can’t roll in with a blue light on top of his or her car and be there right after the shooting?

    Quote:
    eJournal: So the armed citizen gets through the initial police response; now their lawyer is present. How do they keep that lawyer on the right track? What can they do if their lawyer goes off point, maybe they want to plead out, for example?

    Ayoob: First, if the guy says, “Plead to something,” when you’ve done nothing wrong, fire him now! He does not understand how to defend innocent people; that is the strategy of the guilty man’s lawyer. My experience has been that a guilty man’s lawyer who gives you a guilty man’s defense, will get you a guilty man’s verdict.

    When in doubt, call the Network. We’ll find someone for you.

    eJournal: So don’t try to salvage that lawyer?

    Ayoob: You’ve done the right thing! Don’t plead because the guy tells you to plead because it is going to be easier for him and cheaper for you! Is it going to be cheaper for you to be a convicted felon for the rest of your life, unable to protect your family, unable to get the kinds of jobs to earn the living that you might have earned otherwise? That does not strike me as victory. It’s the kind of thing that people do when they’re terrified of things they don’t understand and they are, in essence, being blackmailed by the other side’s threats.

    Ayoob is a cop, he trusts cops far too much. This is why he tells you to always call 911, and I say it's an option.

    Telling your full story before trial gives the cops and DA time to shape a version of your guilt that wraps around the truth, without being true. Their initial version may have you committing a crime at 9:00 PM in Allentown; if you provide proof that you were in Harrisburg at 9:05, they will simply change their theory to one where you committed the crime in Allentown at 10:00. If you explain what happened while you're still in shock after a defensive shooting, you WILL get some details wrong, and those inconsistencies WILL be used against you in court. But if you save your story until trial, you rebut their theory of the case while the jury is watching.

    As for an innocent man pleading to a crime he didn't commit, that's a function of the evidence. If your client seems evasive to you, he will seem evasive to a jury, and if the several witnesses against him are more experienced liars, the jury will likely believe them. When the police report contains lies (and they often do), you face an uphill battle in court. When 2 or 3 "disinterested" cops claim that your client confessed, or they place the incident earlier or later or 100 feet north or whatever, the jury will tend to believe them, and not the "perp". I have seen police reports that were obviously designed to defeat the available defenses, rather than objectively report the facts available. You HAVE to give the client the odds, and sometimes pleading to a bogus summary or M3 is a whole lot better than being convicted of a felony or two.

  5. #5
    Join Date
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    King of Prussia, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: "Triple A for 2A" - JPFO - Retain a Lawyer for $99/year

    I like the JPFO, and am a member... yet I am not a member of the "tribe" so to speak.

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