Stupid Question about the Fla. "Loophole"

[spoonltz28]

Maybe I am missing something here or I am just stupid.

With all this talk about the "loophole'
This is just about CARRYING a Concealed weapon?? Correct???

Even if you get a Fla permit, that does not enable you to walk into a gun shop and PURCHASE a handgun here in Pa. You still have to go through the Pennsylvania background check to be able to purchase a handgun ????

If this is the case, why hasn't anybody brought this up in any of the televised debates.????

What am I missing?

[MrBi11]

the lack of logic the media / anti's have

[GunLawyer001]

Maybe I am missing something here or I am just stupid.

With all this talk about the "loophole'
This is just about CARRYING a Concealed weapon?? Correct???

Even if you get a Fla permit, that does not enable you to walk into a gun shop and PURCHASE a handgun here in Pa. You still have to go through the Pennsylvania background check to be able to purchase a handgun ????

If this is the case, why hasn't anybody brought this up in any of the televised debates.????

What am I missing?

You're right, and I have never heard of anyone who was denied by PICS but was able to get an out-of-state permit. Every instance of this "loophole" has been someone denied a PA LTCF under the character or reputation clause, which is the sort of catch-all that sheriffs use the same way that cops use "disorderly conduct", to do what they want to do when the statutes don't really allow them to.

I think it should be amended. There are plenty of good reasons to deny or revoke LTCF's, and there's not very much abuse of those other reasons, because there's less wiggle-room. Either you have a PFA, or you don't. You were convicted of crimes, or not. The solution to unconvicted bad people is not to deny them licenses, it's to convict them and get them off the streets.

The character/reputation clause is a good example of the axiom that hard cases make bad law. There are some serious badasses out there who have managed to avoid conviction, but the remedy is not to make LTCF's discretionary for everyone, the remedy is law enforcement.

[Sandcut]

Maybe I am missing something here or I am just stupid.

With all this talk about the "loophole'
This is just about CARRYING a Concealed weapon?? Correct???

Even if you get a Fla permit, that does not enable you to walk into a gun shop and PURCHASE a handgun here in Pa. You still have to go through the Pennsylvania background check to be able to purchase a handgun ????

If this is the case, why hasn't anybody brought this up in any of the televised debates.????

What am I missing?

No. You're not missing anything. This is an entirely fabricated "loophole." Florida's permit covers carrying a concealed weapon, which is not limited to just a firearm. It also includes knives, billy clubs, etc. (which may be legal in FL but, may be prohibited by other statute in PA.) The information that is always lacking in the media's portrayal of FL's permit is that it has no bearing on PA law as to who can possess or purchase a firearm.

If you are prohibited from owning a firearm because of any of the crimes enumerated in the UFA, you can carry a Florida permit all that you want, it still doesn't convey the ability to lawfully possess a firearm.

If you look at the requirements for obtaining a FL permit and the circumstances under which you are prohibited from carrying concealed under its authority it is far more limiting than a PA LTCF. Under a FL permit you are not permitted to carry in a place where alcohol is served or a sporting event at a College or University. You may not carry at County or municipal offices or polling places, all of which are lawful in PA to carry in unless they are associated with other prohibited sites (e.g., schools, courthouses, etc.) However, even though you may lawfully carry in these places in PA, you are prohibited by the requirements of Florida's permit from carrying in these places. To do so subjects you, as a minimum, to revocation of your permit by Florida.

The only part of the FL requirements that I can see that are less restrictive than PA LTCF requirements is for certain crimes you may be eligible if greater than three years has elapsed since you fulfilled probation requirements. From what I can surmise from this, you would be eligible for a FL permit but, would still be a prohibited person under PA statute.

Furthermore, the State's Attorney General (the office, not the person) has already declared, via formal written approval of reciprocal agreement, that the requirements of Florida's concealed carry permit are substantively the same as PA's. If they weren't, there would not be reciprocity. The same could be said for other state's driver's licenses. If there was another state that had drastically lower requirements for obtaining a driver's license, there would not be reciprocal acceptance between states.

The only people that seem to have an issue with the whole FL permit issue seem to be aggregated in the southeastern corner of the state. I also hear that PA's "shall issue" requirements are viewed as mere guidelines in the same jurisdiction.

[spoonltz28]

No. You're not missing anything.
If you are prohibited from owning a firearm because of any of the crimes enumerated in the UFA, you can carry a Florida permit all that you want, it still doesn't convey the ability to lawfully possess a firearm.

That is what I thought. But I am suprised that no-body has ever said anything about it.
What good is a carry permit if you can not LEGALLY own a gun ??????

As for the Fla permit, I did apply for it and was denied.
At the same time that I was waiting , I applied for the Pa permit and recieved it. Go figure.

[Sandcut]

That is what I thought. But I am suprised that no-body has ever said anything about it.
What good is a carry permit if you can not LEGALLY own a gun ??????

As for the Fla permit, I did apply for it and was denied.
At the same time that I was waiting , I applied for the Pa permit and recieved it. Go figure.

1. If you listened to any of the House or Senate procedings on HB 40, very little of the debate actually touched on the actual wording of the bill but, rather, on conjecture about what it was percieved to say.

2. Did FL give a reason for why you were denied? If not, do you know why?

[spoonltz28]

Yes, I did watch the debates. Thank god I shave my head, otherwise it would be coming out in clumps. LOL

As for the Fla permit, they nixed me on an incident that happended in NJ back in 1997. Criminal mischief with damage.
(car accident that ended bad)

[JonEMTP]

There are no stupid questions in this case. Just stupid politicians.

[Wiley-X]

You may not carry at County or municipal offices or polling places, all of which are lawful in PA to carry in unless they are associated with other prohibited sites (e.g., schools, courthouses, etc.) However, even though you may lawfully carry in these places in PA, you are prohibited by the requirements of Florida's permit from carrying in these places. To do so subjects you, as a minimum, to revocation of your permit by Florida.

Are you saying that if you have a Florida permit are in Pennsylvania that Florida rules apply?

[ehidle]

There is no "loophole." PA Law says that PA honors non-resident permits from certain other states. If you have such a permit, and are not a prohibited person (different states may have different criteria for prohibited persons - I don't know), you can carry concealed in PA or OC/CC in cities of the first class, etc etc blah blah blah

It's not a loophole in the law, it is just the law.