Road Trip - Michigan CPL reciprocity

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Hey fellow gun owners =) I am from the People's Republic of Michigan and will be taking a road trip with some Army buddies before we head off to Afghanistan. After passing through Ohio, we'll be spending a day or two in Pittsburgh and Philadelphia. I understand that MI and PA do have a reciprocity agreement, but I am curious if there are any special laws I need to know about, for either the whole state of PA, or just those two cities. Any advice or warnings you might have that an out-of-stater like me should know about carrying in Pittsburgh and Philly would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, and good luck on Castle Doctrine.

[knight0334]

Stay away from 1000ft school zones without a PA LTCF, unless you lock your unloaded gun up in a case.

Reading material for PA: http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-ope...nsylvania.html

[HiredGoon]

The OP can get a PA LTCF from Centre County in less than 2 weeks thru the mail, if he desires.

http://www.co.centre.pa.us/sheriff/l...pplication.asp

[chez323]

Have a safe trip, use common sense and be careful once you get in country. And if you happen end up at Camp Phoenix Kabul say hi to my buddy Jeff (AF E-8, can't be to many of them on base).

And thanks for your service!

Hey fellow gun owners =) I am from the People's Republic of Michigan and will be taking a road trip with some Army buddies before we head off to Afghanistan. After passing through Ohio, we'll be spending a day or two in Pittsburgh and Philadelphia. I understand that MI and PA do have a reciprocity agreement, but I am curious if there are any special laws I need to know about, for either the whole state of PA, or just those two cities. Any advice or warnings you might have that an out-of-stater like me should know about carrying in Pittsburgh and Philly would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, and good luck on Castle Doctrine.

[donm]

Stay away from 1000ft school zones without a PA LTCF, unless you lock your unloaded gun up in a case.

You do realize that this is impossible in practice, right? Take a look at the GFSZ map for Cleveland at http://www.gunlaws.com/images/GFSZ%20Cleveland.jpg. It's a very low risk (no non-resident license holder has been successfully prosecuted for it), but keep in mind that it is out there.

[mrjam2jab]

I thought there was a US federal law that over-ruled the 1000ft school zone?!?

There is a Federal GFSZ law, but any state law would over-rule it.

18 USC 922 (q)(4)

(4) Nothing in this subsection shall be construed as preempting
or preventing a State or local government from enacting a statute
establishing gun free school zones as provided in this subsection.

[knight0334]

I thought there was a US federal law that over-ruled the 1000ft school zone?!?

The federal law is the 1000ft school zone thing.. You need a license/permit from the state in which the school is located. IE: if you are in PA, you need a PA LTCF. Reciprocal licenses do not cover you in the 1000ft range.

[knight0334]

There is a Federal GFSZ law, but any state law would over-rule it.

18 USC 922 (q)(4)

That doesn't say they over-rule the Fed GFSZA, it merely says the Federal Govt isn't preempting states from making additional laws.

Constitutionally the GFSZA over-rules state laws via the Supremacy Clause, so you have to abide by it no matter what. The states then can make additional requirements and requirements.

Fortunately the Fed GFSZA is treated as a secondary offense in practice even though it is a primary offense. Those charged and convicted are usually popped for doing something else illegal first.

[knight0334]

You do realize that this is impossible in practice, right? Take a look at the GFSZ map for Cleveland at http://www.gunlaws.com/images/GFSZ%20Cleveland.jpg. It's a very low risk (no non-resident license holder has been successfully prosecuted for it), but keep in mind that it is out there.

I realize it completely. But it doesn't negate the fact the law is what it is.

[donm]

Stay away from 1000ft school zones without a PA LTCF, unless you lock your unloaded gun up in a case.

I'm just taking issue with the "certainty" of this impossible command. If you follow this directive, you will only ever carry in states that have issued you a permit/license. Even a church that happens to have a school is a "school" for the purpose of this law, and you likely wouldn't even know it is there. There is a very small risk to be sure, but it's one that most of us choose to accept.