Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    http://www.kirotv.com/news/25233137/detail.html

    Posted: 5:43 pm PDT September 30, 2010Updated: 7:19 pm PDT September 30, 2010

    SPANAWAY, Wash. -- A Spanaway man said his rights were violated by Pierce County sheriff's deputies after he walked into a Starbucks wearing a handgun and was asked for identification.

    Tom Brewster said he carries a pistol with him just about everywhere he goes, so when he stopped by a Starbucks in Spanaway a couple of days ago, as he does every day, he was armed, as he is every day.

    “Soon as I got in line, the sheriff’s officer approached me from behind and asked, ‘Is that a gun? I’m going to need to see your ID,’” Brewster said.

    Brewster refused to comply.

    He said that being asked by a sheriff’s deputy simply because he was carrying a firearm was a violation of his Fourth Amendment rights.

    The Fourth Amendment generally protects U.S. citizens against unreasonable search and seizure.

    “If you’re not committing any crimes they have no business asking you to identify yourself,” Brewster said.

    Brewster likened the incident to something that would happen in Nazi Germany.

    Pierce County Sheriff’s Department Spokesman Ed Troyed said in a situation like Brewster’s, deputies have the right to identify anyone who poses a potential threat.

    “The problem here isn’t that he was carrying the gun, it was that he was uncooperative and made a big deal about it,” Troyer said. “His rights weren’t violated. We have the right, as police, to ask questions and to make sure the public’s safe and to make sure baristas are safe. I mean, Maurice Clemmons walked into a coffee shop carrying guns.”

    Coincidentally, Starbucks coffee shops have become sites of contention in the issue of openly carrying arms. Open-carry advocates have gathered at Starbucks locations to exercise their right to carry guns. Starbucks has said it’s OK with that, despite the fact that others have protested.

    Brewster said he plans to be back at Starbucks this weekend.

    “I was there today, I’ll be there tomorrow and probably next week,” he said.

    Copyright 2010 by KIROTV.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

    ****

    And the entire incident was recorded: http://forum.nwcdl.org/index.php?act...downfile;id=70

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    So did they get his id?
    Millions for defense, Not one cent for tribute!

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks




    The Nazi Germany comparison was perfect! Now, if only someone would write an article like that and actually criticize the officer for violating his rights instead of making his "we have the right to question people" argument seem somehow valid by staying silent about it... then we'd be getting somewhere! Instead, the writer was too concerned with offending someone and probably too lazy to look up the actual law that states that what the officers said is dead wrong... it's not legal at all.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    Quote Originally Posted by Benjamin455 View Post

    Pierce County Sheriff’s Department Spokesman Ed Troyed said in a situation like Brewster’s, deputies have the right to identify anyone who poses a potential threat.

    “The problem here isn’t that he was carrying the gun, it was that he was uncooperative and made a big deal about it,” Troyer said. “His rights weren’t violated. We have the right, as police, to ask questions and to make sure the public’s safe and to make sure baristas are safe. I mean, Maurice Clemmons walked into a coffee shop carrying guns.”
    1. Apparently you don't know how the fourth amendment works.

    2. Which is exactly why they asked everyone else besides him for their ID first. We just didn't hear that part.


    I'm not sure how state law works over there. But, sounds like more uninformed LEOs.
    I'm so fast, I can bump fire a bolt action.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    The LEO has it 1/2 right. He has the right to ask. What he forgot is we have the right not to answer the SS, I mean sheriffs questions.
    Fraggle09027 is not a lawyer. Any advice is just advice (my own 2 cents) and is not expressed or implied as legal advice.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    Why do people give in to these a$$holes? I simply don't get it.

    He gave ID, he gave in, he basically told those cops that the BULLSH!T they spewed out of their mouths was OK


    I literally couldn't FORCE myself to listen to the entire audio clip, it disgusted me that much
    Last edited by BimmerJon; October 1st, 2010 at 10:15 PM.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! the Police have no rights as police. They are granted some authority that the regular public doesn't have but, this situation isn't part of that authority.


    Quote Originally Posted by Benjamin455 View Post
    http://www.kirotv.com/news/25233137/detail.html

    Posted: 5:43 pm PDT September 30, 2010Updated: 7:19 pm PDT September 30, 2010
    We have the right, as police, to ask questions and to make sure the public’s safe

    Copyright 2010 by KIROTV.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

    ****

    And the entire incident was recorded: http://forum.nwcdl.org/index.php?act...downfile;id=70
    USNRET '61-'81

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    Quote Originally Posted by BimmerJon View Post
    Why do people give in to these a$$holes? I simply don't get it.
    Stress, particularly adrenalin fueled stress can be very petrifying, for lack of a better term, and cause you to succumb to circumstances you would not ordinarily think you would. And react in ways other than calculated prior.

    Until, and unless, you yourself are in that particular position you may not understand the difficulty involved due to the stresses and intimidation. Ask me how I know.
    _________________________________________

    danbus wrote: ...Like I said before, I open carry because you don't, I fight for all my rights because
    you won't, I will not sit with my thumb up my bum and complain, because you will.
    Remember Meleanie

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    Maybe it is time to start carry another form of ID:

    "Perhaps this silver bullet will identify me...:"
    "...a REPUBLIC, if you can keep it."

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Spanaway, WA Open Carry Incident With Law Enforcement At Starbucks

    Quote Originally Posted by Pa. Patriot View Post
    Stress, particularly adrenalin fueled stress can be very petrifying, for lack of a better term, and cause you to succumb to circumstances you would not ordinarily think you would. And react in ways other than calculated prior.

    Until, and unless, you yourself are in that particular position you may not understand the difficulty involved due to the stresses and intimidation. Ask me how I know.
    ^ Yeah all of this.
    I read up, I knew what to do. I ran through it in my head
    Boy did I fuck up...
    Good learning experience. Ive dealt with pricks since and think it will go much better if it happens again, and I so hope it doesnt. Being put on the spot is hard to deal with. They tend to be hardassed about it too because they think they have the authority and know the law.
    Millions for defense, Not one cent for tribute!

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