Hunting versus killing

[spagluvx]

With all of the recent threads on "ram hunting" and "pigeon shoots" I was wondering how others differentiate hunting versus killing of animals? I am asking this because I am a "hunter" and I would never tell people that I am an animal killer.

I am an active hunter who has hunted or plans on hunting all of the available game in PA. I have been involved in hunting and fur taking for over 25 years and I have enjoyed every minute of it. I have "killed" while hunting all of the big game available in PA except for a PA elk and most of the small game species in PA. I have a blind for my first goose hunt on the first of November. I personally have not really ever given this topic much of a thought and I wanted to see where we as hunters/killers draw the line. What is the difference?

I personally define my "hunting" (as opposed to killing) experience and why I like to hunt as the following:

I personally have not and will not ever enjoy seeing an animal die. Yeah, I know its the the end of the hunt but I really do not enjoy that part.

I personally enjoy the sounds of the hounds on a rabbit and their excitement when we get one and their disappointment when we miss.

I personally enjoy spending a day in the field with no cell phone ( on my person but not on) with my family and friends. I have spent some of the best days of my life in the field and never shot an animal.

I personally believe that a hunter or the family of should consume all of the game that they kill.

I personally do not care if we get one or not. This is why I will never pay to hunt, the times spent in field are priceless.

This post was not in response to any of the OP's in the beginning of the thread but only to try and determine the difference between hunting and killing......

[A-5]

This might not go where you intended it to go but humans have souls animals do not. They are the inferior species and God intended them for consumption. There is a sporting aspect of the whole thing but the death part I agree with you, I don't enjoy watching death but it goes with the territory. As far as hunting vs killing. Anyone that pays for a hunt in a pen has got to look at themselves in the mirror and not like what they see. Unfortunately most do like what they see and thats the problem. If you hunt in a area that is penned up that is killing. Go ahead take your pictures of the "trophy" that was shot in a pen go brag to your buddies and be a big shot. Those guys are small people in my world. Although there is nothing illegal about it I personally think it's wrong. 100% fair chase is hunting.

[Glenn Lynn]

I really have to agree with the previous two posts. I have spent many hours hunting without shooting a thing. Not because it was not there to shoot but because I did not want to. I love squirrel hunting. I used to sit in a nest of leaves and eat more apples than I would shoot squirrels. I used to coon hunt. The sound of the baying hounds was better than hearing the crack of a gun any day. Occasionally we shot one to keep the dogs interested.

Now I am handicapped and get about in a mobility scooter. Am I going hunting? You bet! I am going to hunt for squirrels with my Judge and .410 loads. I will really have to pick my shots. Do I expect to shoot anything? No. But I will have fun. I am also going deer hunting from my scooter. I will use my .44 mag with a scope. Once again, I will really have to choose my shots. Again, I don't expect to shoot anything.

Shooting caged animals in my opinion is not sport. Neither is a perfectly healthy person road hunting from a vehicle.

For me, it is the hunt that is exciting - not the kill.

[Michele]

kill (kil)

transitive verb

1. to cause the death of; make die
2.
1. to destroy the vital or active qualities of
2. to destroy; put an end to; ruin
3. to prevent the passage of (legislation); defeat or veto
4. to spend (time) on matters of little or no importance
5.
1. to cause (an engine, etc.) to stop; turn off
2. to turn off (a light, esp. a theater spotlight)
3. to muffle (sound)
6. to prevent publication of: to kill a newspaper story
7. to spoil the effect of; destroy by contrast: said of colors, etc.
8. Informal to overcome with laughter, chagrin, pleasure, surprise, etc.
9. Informal to cause to feel great pain or discomfort
10. Informal to tire out; exhaust
11. Slang to drink the last, or all, of (a bottle of liquor, etc.); finish off
12. Printing to mark as not to be used; score out; cancel
13. Tennis, etc. to return (the ball) with such force that it cannot be returned

Origin: ME kullen, killen < ? OE *cyllan, special late phonetic development of cwellan, to kill: see quell

intransitive verb

1. to destroy life
2. to be killed: plants that kill easily

noun

1. an act or instance of killing
2. an animal or animals killed
3. an enemy plane, ship, etc. destroyed

hunt·ing (hunt′iŋ)

noun

1. the act of a person or animal that hunts
2. a periodic oscillation of the rotor of a synchronous electrical machine about its average position
3. a periodic oscillation in the controlled function of any feedback control system, as a thermostat, caused by fluctuation in the control system
4. any similar fluctuation, as of a control surface, compass, indicator, etc.

Origin: ME < OE huntung

adjective
of or for hunting

hunt·ing (hŭnˈtĭng)
noun

1. The activity or sport of pursuing game.
2. The act of conducting a search for something: house hunting.
3. Electronics The periodic variation in speed of a synchronous motor with respect to the current.


Hunting

cynegetics

the sport of hunting. —cynegetic, adj.

falconry

1. the sport of hunting with falcons or other trained birds of prey.

2. the training of birds of prey.

venation

Archaic. the sport or occupation of hunting. —venatic, venatical, venational, adj.

venery

1. Archaic. the sport, practice, or art of hunting or the chase.

2. the animals that are hunted.

mur·der (mʉr′dər)

noun

1. the unlawful and malicious or premeditated killing of one human being by another; also, any killing done while committing some other felony, as rape or robbery
2. Informal something very hard, unsafe, or disagreeable to do or deal with

Origin: ME murthir, mordre < OE & OFr: OE morthor, akin to ON morth, Goth maurthr; OFr mordre < Frank *morthr: all ult. < IE *mṛtóm < base *mer- > mortal

transitive verb

1. to kill (a person) unlawfully and with malice
2. to kill inhumanly or barbarously, as in warfare
3. to spoil, mar, etc., as in performance: the song was murdered by the singer

intransitive verb
to commit murder

mur·der (mûrˈdər)
noun

1. The unlawful killing of one human by another, especially with premeditated malice.
2. Slang Something that is very uncomfortable, difficult, or hazardous: The rush hour traffic is murder.
3. A flock of crows. See Synonyms at flock1.

verb mur·dered, mur·der·ing, mur·ders
verb, transitive

1. To kill (another human) unlawfully.
2. To kill brutally or inhumanly.
3. To put an end to; destroy: murdered their chances.
4. To spoil by ineptness; mutilate: a speech that murdered the English language.
5. Slang To defeat decisively; trounce.

verb, intransitive
To commit murder.

Hummmm......

[Yoder]

kill (kil)

transitive verb

1. to cause the death of; make die
2.
1. to destroy the vital or active qualities of
2. to destroy; put an end to; ruin
3. to prevent the passage of (legislation); defeat or veto
4. to spend (time) on matters of little or no importance
5.
1. to cause (an engine, etc.) to stop; turn off
2. to turn off (a light, esp. a theater spotlight)
3. to muffle (sound)
6. to prevent publication of: to kill a newspaper story
7. to spoil the effect of; destroy by contrast: said of colors, etc.
8. Informal to overcome with laughter, chagrin, pleasure, surprise, etc.
9. Informal to cause to feel great pain or discomfort
10. Informal to tire out; exhaust
11. Slang to drink the last, or all, of (a bottle of liquor, etc.); finish off
12. Printing to mark as not to be used; score out; cancel
13. Tennis, etc. to return (the ball) with such force that it cannot be returned

Origin: ME kullen, killen < ? OE *cyllan, special late phonetic development of cwellan, to kill: see quell

intransitive verb

1. to destroy life
2. to be killed: plants that kill easily

noun

1. an act or instance of killing
2. an animal or animals killed
3. an enemy plane, ship, etc. destroyed

hunt·ing (hunt′iŋ)

noun

1. the act of a person or animal that hunts
2. a periodic oscillation of the rotor of a synchronous electrical machine about its average position
3. a periodic oscillation in the controlled function of any feedback control system, as a thermostat, caused by fluctuation in the control system
4. any similar fluctuation, as of a control surface, compass, indicator, etc.

Origin: ME < OE huntung

adjective
of or for hunting

hunt·ing (hŭnˈtĭng)
noun

1. The activity or sport of pursuing game.
2. The act of conducting a search for something: house hunting.
3. Electronics The periodic variation in speed of a synchronous motor with respect to the current.


Hunting

cynegetics

the sport of hunting. —cynegetic, adj.

falconry

1. the sport of hunting with falcons or other trained birds of prey.

2. the training of birds of prey.

venation

Archaic. the sport or occupation of hunting. —venatic, venatical, venational, adj.

venery

1. Archaic. the sport, practice, or art of hunting or the chase.

2. the animals that are hunted.

mur·der (mʉr′dər)

noun

1. the unlawful and malicious or premeditated killing of one human being by another; also, any killing done while committing some other felony, as rape or robbery
2. Informal something very hard, unsafe, or disagreeable to do or deal with

Origin: ME murthir, mordre < OE & OFr: OE morthor, akin to ON morth, Goth maurthr; OFr mordre < Frank *morthr: all ult. < IE *mṛtóm < base *mer- > mortal

transitive verb

1. to kill (a person) unlawfully and with malice
2. to kill inhumanly or barbarously, as in warfare
3. to spoil, mar, etc., as in performance: the song was murdered by the singer

intransitive verb
to commit murder

mur·der (mûrˈdər)
noun

1. The unlawful killing of one human by another, especially with premeditated malice.
2. Slang Something that is very uncomfortable, difficult, or hazardous: The rush hour traffic is murder.
3. A flock of crows. See Synonyms at flock1.

verb mur·dered, mur·der·ing, mur·ders
verb, transitive

1. To kill (another human) unlawfully.
2. To kill brutally or inhumanly.
3. To put an end to; destroy: murdered their chances.
4. To spoil by ineptness; mutilate: a speech that murdered the English language.
5. Slang To defeat decisively; trounce.

verb, intransitive
To commit murder.

Hummmm......

MEAT IS MURDER!!!!! Do you eat meat, wear leather? How about Cotton? If yes, then you are helping the "murder" of animals. Did you ever hit an animal with your car? Did you burry it and say a prayer? Even the bible agrees that animals are here for us to eat. So does an animal hold the same value as a human life? How about your life? How about the lives of your children if you have any? Would you "murder" an animal to keep from starving to death or just pet a bunny while you slowly die. Just curious.

People who hunt do it because they love it. It's not about the killing, it's about the challenge and being out in nature. I could kill deer in my back yard anytime but I never do since it's just killing. If I really needed food I would kill a few. Finding the right spot, figuring out when the animal is going to be there, waiting, watching, anticipation when the animal starts coming in. Hoping you can get a shot and ultimately making the shot now that is what hunting is about. Even not taking a shot but knowing you could have is rewarding, since it's about the hunt not the kill.

[mongo]

I really have to agree with the previous two posts. I have spent many hours hunting without shooting a thing. Not because it was not there to shoot but because I did not want to. I love squirrel hunting. I used to sit in a nest of leaves and eat more apples than I would shoot squirrels. I used to coon hunt. The sound of the baying hounds was better than hearing the crack of a gun any day. Occasionally we shot one to keep the dogs interested.

Now I am handicapped and get about in a mobility scooter. Am I going hunting? You bet! I am going to hunt for squirrels with my Judge and .410 loads. I will really have to pick my shots. Do I expect to shoot anything? No. But I will have fun. I am also going deer hunting from my scooter. I will use my .44 mag with a scope. Once again, I will really have to choose my shots. Again, I don't expect to shoot anything.

Shooting caged animals in my opinion is not sport. Neither is a perfectly healthy person road hunting from a vehicle.

For me, it is the hunt that is exciting - not the kill.

You better find out how you are going to "plug" that Judge to the three shot limit.......All the fines are now $100 and the rabbitcops will just love to confiscate that Judge.

[NikeBauer21]

Kill, murder, hunt... whatever you want to call it, they are all tasty in the end.

[God's Country]

Successful hunting means killing, whether the animal was running freely or in a 1000 acre pen. Personally I don’t get paying to kill something, but I have a feeling it’s going to become more and more common as game and land becomes more scarce. That and we live in an instant gratification society, which this type of hunting serves nicely.
Besides paying to hunt isn’t much different than paying for your ground round, which I assume we’re all OK with.

If people want to pay to hunt that’s fine. If people don’t that’s fine too.

[LisaA]

This might not go where you intended it to go but humans have souls animals do not. They are the inferior species and God intended them for consumption. There is a sporting aspect of the whole thing but the death part I agree with you, I don't enjoy watching death but it goes with the territory. As far as hunting vs killing. Anyone that pays for a hunt in a pen has got to look at themselves in the mirror and not like what they see. Unfortunately most do like what they see and thats the problem. If you hunt in a area that is penned up that is killing. Go ahead take your pictures of the "trophy" that was shot in a pen go brag to your buddies and be a big shot. Those guys are small people in my world. Although there is nothing illegal about it I personally think it's wrong. 100% fair chase is hunting.

Bold mine. This part has no bearing on the OP's intent of this thread.

spagluvx's distinction is excellent. Thanks for posting.

[thebearpack]

It's the natural order on this planet that some creatures must die to nourish others. When a shark eats a smaller fish, the fish dies and that's just the order of things. Same thing for a lion taking a gazelle. Those animals don't feel pity, nor should they. It's the way it is. The difference is that we humans (well, most humans) have compassion which tends to get in the way a little and causes us to over think things.

In America especially we have the luxury of being able to pay others to dispatch and process animals for us. That causes a disconnect between the act of taking an animal's life and the food on our table. It is much less the case in poorer countries where most people must still hunt/kill animals daily for their survival.

So I suppose for some people who want to reconnect with the primal nature of taking an animal without really hunting, a staged hunt might be the easy way out.