I had my record expunged can I now buy firearms?

[revelation9985]

then you really ought to be asking this question to an attorney in PA familier with PA state gun laws instead of a discussion board.

Right. That would most likely cost me more money that I could careless to spend on one more lawyer. Thought there might be a good chance of someone on this board who would know. Worth a shot that an attorney who visits this board might give the concrete correct answer, or someone who was in the same situation in the pass.

Also the PICS fee is $10 no matter how many guns I plan to buy at one time correct.

[revelation9985]

Just go to a FFL and buy a pistol. You'll find out within 15 mins. I would recommend that you buy your shotgun used, face to face, after you buy your pistol. You don't need to buy a shotty thru an FFL. You can do it between the owner and yourself.

This sounds like a good idea. Hopefully it goes through.

[MDJschool]

Instead of going through all the paperwork, only to get denied... (creating MORE paperwork) we suggest they take a ride in to the County courthouse to obtain a concealed carry permit. The permit process involves the same background check... but without the risk of possibly breaking another law by attempting to purchase a gun by a prohibited person. Obviously the permit process in some counties is a bit more difficult... but here in Berks it's pretty streamlined.

Gun purchasers should really make an attempt to know their criminal history 'to the best of their information, knowledge, and belief' because prosecutors and courts are less forgiving than legislators regarding the term 'knowing(ly)'. If a person applies for an LTCF, he's going to be just as liable for false swearing as he will be for trying to acquire a firearm. We've gone through some hypotheticals here just for the sake of those who come on to read the thread later who are not the OP, and based on the information he's given us, we can't see a reason to believe he was prohibited without the expungment, or why an expungment wouldn't be effective. On the other hand, he didn't cite the actual section of statute his charge was based on, or hints of any other potential criminal history, etc. If a person pursues a LTCF, gets denied, and fails to get that overturned, he is presumably banned for a year from reapplication. There exists no such ban when buying arms.

However,

Thought there might be a good chance of someone on this board who would know. Worth a shot that an attorney who visits this board might give the concrete correct answer, or someone who was in the same situation in the pass.

Not even an attorney can give you a 'concrete' answer (here), for one you aren't even going to have an attorney-client privileged relationship so it will not be 'legal advice' for the probable poster, and also how a police officer, DA, judge, or jury sees any of it will ultimately be different than you, I, or that lawyer-poster. You are giving us limited information, and we are giving you limited responses; we're each hinting to each other to hopefully converge upon a useful and factual conclusion. But none of can be sure we're "correct" so far as avoiding adverse consequences, whether or not those consequences should exist. Exercising your rights is dangerous by (government's) design.

Also the PICS fee is $10 no matter how many guns I plan to buy at one time correct.

I think it's going be $2 (non-refundable?) for a single check which can cover multiple firearms from a sale, but there's going to be the $3 excise on each firearm sold. The fee designations are in statute somewhere, but for expedience now, I refreshed my memory using some PA gubmint reports, on PICS fees, 2000 and 2006. Where did you come up with $10? Was it the price for an EPATCH PA background check? The PICS system is different as far as charges, and is set out by statute or regulation.
EDIT:
18 PA.C.S. 6111(b)(3)
(3) Requested by means of a telephone call that the Pennsylvania State Police conduct a criminal history, juvenile delinquency history and a mental health record check. The purchaser and the licensed dealer shall provide such information as is necessary to accurately identify the purchaser. The requester shall be charged a fee equivalent to the cost of providing the service but not to exceed $2 per buyer or transferee.
18 Pa.C.S. 6111.2(a)
(a) Surcharge imposed.--There is hereby imposed on each sale of a firearm subject to tax under Article II of the act of March 4, 1971 (P.L. 6, No. 2), known as the Tax Reform Code of 1971, [FN1] an additional surcharge of $3. This shall be referred to as the Firearm Sale Surcharge. All moneys received from this surcharge shall be deposited in the Firearm Instant Records Check Fund.

[God's Country]

Right. That would most likely cost me more money that I could careless to spend on one more lawyer. Thought there might be a good chance of someone on this board who would know. Worth a shot that an attorney who visits this board might give the concrete correct answer, or someone who was in the same situation in the pass

Look you made a mistake. You should be damn happy you got PTI, or you may very well have been prohibited for life. If it costs you more money to make yourself comfortable then that’s your deal. Everyone here is trying to guide you. You’re seeking free advice from non attorneys, and IMO you’ve received some good information.

Based on the information you provided you were convicted of nothing that would be a prohibited offense. An arrest record alone (if you still had one) will not prevent you from buying a gun in Pa. This isn't NJ....not yet any way. If there is some glitch on your record it’s likely going to be there tomorrow and ten years from now, so you might as well jump in head first and solve any issues.

[revelation9985]

Gun purchasers should really make an attempt to know their criminal history 'to the best of their information, knowledge, and belief' because prosecutors and courts are less forgiving than legislators regarding the term 'knowing(ly)'. If a person applies for an LTCF, he's going to be just as liable for false swearing as he will be for trying to acquire a firearm. We've gone through some hypotheticals here just for the sake of those who come on to read the thread later who are not the OP, and based on the information he's given us, we can't see a reason to believe he was prohibited without the expungment, or why an expungment wouldn't be effective. On the other hand, he didn't cite the actual section of statute his charge was based on, or hints of any other potential criminal history, etc. If a person pursues a LTCF, gets denied, and fails to get that overturned, he is presumably banned for a year from reapplication. There exists no such ban when buying arms.

However,

Not even an attorney can give you a 'concrete' answer (here), for one you aren't even going to have an attorney-client privileged relationship so it will not be 'legal advice' for the probable poster, and also how a police officer, DA, judge, or jury sees any of it will ultimately be different than you, I, or that lawyer-poster. You are giving us limited information, and we are giving you limited responses; we're each hinting to each other to hopefully converge upon a useful and factual conclusion. But none of can be sure we're "correct" so far as avoiding adverse consequences, whether or not those consequences should exist. Exercising your rights is dangerous by (government's) design.



I think it's going be $2 (non-refundable?) for a single check which can cover multiple firearms from a sale, but there's going to be the $3 excise on each firearm sold. The fee designations are in statute somewhere, but for expedience now, I refreshed my memory using some PA gubmint reports, on PICS fees, 2000 and 2006. Where did you come up with $10? Was it the price for an EPATCH PA background check? The PICS system is different as far as charges, and is set out by statute or regulation.
EDIT:
18 PA.C.S. 6111(b)(3)
(3) Requested by means of a telephone call that the Pennsylvania State Police conduct a criminal history, juvenile delinquency history and a mental health record check. The purchaser and the licensed dealer shall provide such information as is necessary to accurately identify the purchaser. The requester shall be charged a fee equivalent to the cost of providing the service but not to exceed $2 per buyer or transferee.
18 Pa.C.S. 6111.2(a)
(a) Surcharge imposed.--There is hereby imposed on each sale of a firearm subject to tax under Article II of the act of March 4, 1971 (P.L. 6, No. 2), known as the Tax Reform Code of 1971, [FN1] an additional surcharge of $3. This shall be referred to as the Firearm Sale Surcharge. All moneys received from this surcharge shall be deposited in the Firearm Instant Records Check Fund.

I will go down to my firearms dealer and try and purchase some firearms. I will see what happens. My dealer had a $10 fee for some check/application fee but for exactly what Im not sure and will find out soon.

[Xringshooter]

I think it's going be $2 (non-refundable?) for a single check which can cover multiple firearms from a sale, but there's going to be the $3 excise on each firearm sold. The fee designations are in statute somewhere, but for expedience now, I refreshed my memory using some PA gubmint reports, on PICS fees, 2000 and 2006. Where did you come up with $10? Was it the price for an EPATCH PA background check? The PICS system is different as far as charges, and is set out by statute or regulation.
EDIT:
18 PA.C.S. 6111(b)(3)
(3) Requested by means of a telephone call that the Pennsylvania State Police conduct a criminal history, juvenile delinquency history and a mental health record check. The purchaser and the licensed dealer shall provide such information as is necessary to accurately identify the purchaser. The requester shall be charged a fee equivalent to the cost of providing the service but not to exceed $2 per buyer or transferee.
18 Pa.C.S. 6111.2(a)
(a) Surcharge imposed.--There is hereby imposed on each sale of a firearm subject to tax under Article II of the act of March 4, 1971 (P.L. 6, No. 2), known as the Tax Reform Code of 1971, [FN1] an additional surcharge of $3. This shall be referred to as the Firearm Sale Surcharge. All moneys received from this surcharge shall be deposited in the Firearm Instant Records Check Fund.

The $3 only comes into play if the sale of the gun is subject to PA Sales Tax. A gun (actually anything) bought from out of state is PA Sales Tax exempt so you don't pay the $3 surcharge (unless the place selling it has a place of business in PA, then even if bought from the out of state store it is subject to PA sales tax or if the out of state business collects PA sales tax, then the $3 fee would be owed). That is not to say the person buying the gun doesn't owe the state a tax, you do, it's called the PA Use Tax and is the same amount as the sales tax rate where you live. It is NOT just a tax on businesses, it is on anyone who buys something from out of state and no PA sales tax is collected. That said, most people do no pay it and I don't know how hard the state would go after an individual. An FFL is under NO obligation (and legally cannot) collect the Use Tax from someone. Owing the Use Tax does not force the payment of the $3 surcharge.

[wellcraft]

Right. That would most likely cost me more money that I could careless to spend on one more lawyer. Thought there might be a good chance of someone on this board who would know. Worth a shot that an attorney who visits this board might give the concrete correct answer, or someone who was in the same situation in the pass.

Also the PICS fee is $10 no matter how many guns I plan to buy at one time correct.

i understand you want to save money by not having to turn to an attorney for help but you also want to stay out of trouble. for legal issues i wouldn't take the advice of anyone on any gun discussion board regardless of who they said they were or how much sense the information they provided made unless i could sit down in their office and confirm they were an attorney. there's a lot of good info provided in this thread but i'd bet you could speak with a attorney who is familiar with PA gun law that could advise you and not charge a fee. at times a simple consultation is free and you're not looking at paying money unless the lawyer has to represent you. good luck and hopefully things will work out for you.

[revelation9985]

Look you made a mistake. You should be damn happy you got PTI, or you may very well have been prohibited for life. If it costs you more money to make yourself comfortable then that’s your deal. Everyone here is trying to guide you. You’re seeking free advice from non attorneys, and IMO you’ve received some good information.

Based on the information you provided you were convicted of nothing that would be a prohibited offense. An arrest record alone (if you still had one) will not prevent you from buying a gun in Pa. This isn't NJ....not yet any way. If there is some glitch on your record it’s likely going to be there tomorrow and ten years from now, so you might as well jump in head first and solve any issues.

Damn happy? It was bought and paid for. I spent $10,000 on the lawyer who had the connections to make sure of it. It was $200 worth of drugs that I should not have bought on New Years Eve of that year. $200 mistake turns into $10,000 plus the $1,250 to get it expunged. Sorry about not feeling to great about spending more of my life savings on lawyers. I have paid for my horrible mistake 100 times over. I will see if I can get the info from a lawyer here in PA with a free consultation.

Does the application they make you fill out for buying a pistol ask if you have ever been arrested?

[revelation9985]

i understand you want to save money by not having to turn to an attorney for help but you also want to stay out of trouble. for legal issues i wouldn't take the advice of anyone on any gun discussion board regardless of who they said they were or how much sense the information they provided made unless i could sit down in their office and confirm they were an attorney. there's a lot of good info provided in this thread but i'd bet you could speak with a attorney who is familiar with PA gun law that could advise you and not charge a fee. at times a simple consultation is free and you're not looking at paying money unless the lawyer has to represent you. good luck and hopefully things will work out for you.

I will see if I can get the free consultation from a lawyer here in PA. Then I will post here what he or she tells me. Everyone who spent the time giving me great info here thanks so much.

[revelation9985]

I will be going down to my local gun show tomorrow and will see if I get denied. Should I buy a used gun instead? I heard PA law that you dont need a backround check if buying from someones personal collection, is that correct?