Radnor Township Commissioners Meeting Tonight 6-21 7 PM

[TaePo]

Thanks anonymouse. I need to gather other examples to send them too. I still can't believe what Rice said though.

Once you consolidate the other preemption threads, notices and news links, you may wish to forward or call to the attention of admin or moderator. They may wish to sticky it or make it otherwise available to others who could probably use the same proof in addition to the actual statute from the Reference library (upper right). Maybe a thread will develop that only mods can add to so we can add new information once confirmed and that way the list can be kept up to date.

Just an idea.

[anonymouse]

We can probably find newspaper articles for at least 15 different municipalities who changed changed their preemption violations in the past few years.

Anyone have any handy? I know t1m0thy was in the news a few times recently. I'll see what I can come up with.

[GL23]

Thanks. Any help would be appreciated.

[anonymouse]

Upper Allen Township, Cumberland County

http://penn.live.advance.net/news/pa...770.xml&coll=1

(full article from google cache: )

Gun bans fall, raising applause, concerns
Restrictions at places such as parks give way to a state law allowing loaded guns. Gun advocates welcome the rights, while others say they worry about safety.
Friday, May 14, 2010
BY MONICA VON DOBENECK mdobeneck@patriot-news.com

The state law that lets just about anybody openly carry a loaded gun anywhere is butting up against municipal laws that outlaw guns from parks where children play.

Upper Allen Twp. is reversing its ban on guns in parks after a resident wrote officials that the ordinance is illegal. Manager Lou Fazekas said officials were aware earlier that the ban is at odds with the state's Uniform Firearms Act, but decided against taking action until a resident raised a complaint.

"It doesn't matter how I feel," Fazekas said. "We have to comply with state laws."

It's not a change that sits particularly well with Susan Vigliano as she sat with friends at a picnic table under a shade tree at the Upper Allen Community Park while their children played Wednesday.

"As a parent, I don't like the idea of having guns in parks," she said.

Her friend Angela Moran said she grew up around guns and "a law's a law," but "I don't really understand why you would bring a gun to a park."

Heidi Bert said she could see the purpose if, for instance, someone is running by herself in a remote area.

She said she would "probably pay a little more attention" if she saw someone carrying a gun. "I wouldn't leave unless I got an eerie feeling," Bert said.

Nationwide, advocates of open carry have been increasingly challenging restrictions. They made headlines recently for visiting Starbucks while armed.

President Barack Obama approved a law in February allowing people to carry loaded guns in national parks, reversing a law originally signed by President Ronald Reagan.

"The speed at which guns laws are being relaxed is increasing," said John Pierce, a co-founder of OpenCarry.org. "We're very happy about it."

It doesn't please Daniel Vice, the lead attorney for the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence.

"Now you can openly carry an assault weapon into a national park," he said. "Before, national parks had the lowest crime rates in the nation. Since this law passed, two people were shot and one died in a national park in Virginia. Even if a park ranger had seen this person with a shotgun, he couldn't do anything."

Vice said having guns around increases the chance of a tragedy.

Meleanie Hain of Lebanon made national headlines two years ago when she carried a gun to her 5-year-old daughter's soccer game in a Lebanon park. She became a symbol for open-carry advocates when the sheriff took away her concealed-weapons permit. He later returned it and she sued him.

Hain was shot to death in October by her husband in a murder-suicide.

"We see that a lot. When guns are around, they lead to violence," Vice said. "Having a gun in a domestic dispute greatly increases the chance of a shooting."

Pierce said Hain died because of a domestic situation, "not because she chose to carry a firearm."

Pennsylvania, like 27 others, is an open-carry state, meaning people older than 18 don't need a license to openly carry a loaded gun. A license is required for a concealed weapon. Only people prohibited by law from owning guns -- mostly those with criminal backgrounds or mental instabilities -- cannot carry. The only places open carry is banned under state law are schools, courthouses, Philadelphia, secure areas of airports and state parks.

Many midstate municipalities have laws on their books prohibiting guns in their parks, including Susquehanna Twp., Harrisburg, Camp Hill and Derry Twp.

Lower Paxton Twp. manager George Wolf said the township has no such law, but guns are among the restrictions listed on signs at the park entrances. He said the township will most likely change its signs in light of the Upper Allen decision.

Most municipal officials were cautious about commenting on the law. Several were not sure whether their ordinances prohibit guns in parks.

Mike Pries, the chairman of the Derry Twp. supervisors, said that the subject has never come up, but that township officials will look at it.

Lower Swatara Twp. has never had a law banning guns in its parks because "we follow state law, period," Police Chief Richard Wiley said. There has never been a gun incident in a township park, Wiley said.

But he said he thinks the state law is "crazy."

"I'm not a proponent," he said. "You get people who are not properly trained, or there is a chance a criminal could take a gun off a citizen."

Franklin Linn, the chairman of the Lower Swatara commissioners, said people who openly carry loaded guns in public places are showing off.

"I believe in the right to carry arms, but I hesitate because it could scare children in public parks," he said.

While the 117 state parks still prohibit open carry, a change in the law in 2008 allows people with concealed-weapons permits to carry their guns there, said Ryan Dysinger, chief of the operations and training center of the Bureau of State Parks. Hunters, where hunting is allowed, have always been allowed to carry guns.

Dysinger said there have been no complaints since the law was changed.

"One year from now, everyone will be carrying in the parks and it will be a normal part of everyday life," Pierce said.

as a side note, there was a followup letter about that:
http://www.pennlive.com/letters/inde..._gun_laws.html

The article ("Gun bans fall, raising applause, concerns," May 14) written by Monica von Dobeneck, needs clarification. Repeal of local gun laws does not change anything.

State pre-emption has been in place since 1996, and the local laws have been unenforceable since then. Any local municipality that attempts to enforce a ban in violation of pre-emption could find itself sued. It is not the case that people will now suddenly be able to carry guns in parks around children.

It is the case that people have been legally and safely carrying in parks around children for about 14 years. Daniel Vice of the Brady Center is incorrect.

The change in federal laws mirrors state laws on guns in state parks, which means in Pennsylvania you can carry a concealed handgun. You cannot carry openly in a state or national park. You can carry a rifle or shotgun if you are hunting, which has always been the case, but not otherwise. Meleanie Hain's husband was a state law enforcement agent and shot her with a state-issued weapon he would have had regardless of gun laws.

JERRY CORLISS, Lebanon

Hehe.

Another article about it:

Gun rights activists are challenging municipal laws prohibiting people from carrying guns in parks
Published: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:00 AM
Updated: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:38 PM
MONICA VON DOBENECK, The Patriot-News MONICA VON DOBENECK, The Patriot-News

SEAN SIMMERS, The Patriot-NewsHeidi Bert, Jamie Shover and Angela Moran bring their kids to the Upper Allen Township Community Park once a week. Upper Allen Township is removing the law that bans guns in parks, and will take down its sign.The state law that lets just about anybody openly carry a loaded gun anywhere is butting up against municipal laws that outlaw guns from local parks where children play.

Upper Allen Township is reversing its ban on guns in parks after a resident wrote officials that the ordinance is illegal. Manager Lou Fazekas said officials were aware earlier that the ban is at odds with the state’s Uniform Firearms Act, but decided against taking action until a resident raised a complaint.

“It doesn’t matter how I feel,” Fazekas said. “We have to comply with state laws.”

It’s not a change that sits particularly well with Susan Vigliano as she sat with friends at a picnic table under a shade tree at the Upper Allen Township Community Park while their children played on Wednesday.

“As a parent, I don’t like the idea of having guns in parks,” she said.

Her friend, Angela Moran, said she grew up around guns and “a law’s a law,” but “I don’t really understand why you would bring a gun to a park.”

Heidi Bert said she could see the purpose if, for instance, someone is running by herself in a remote area.

She said she would “probably pay a little more attention” if she saw someone carrying a gun. “I wouldn’t leave unless I got an eerie feeling,” Bert said.

Nationwide, advocates of open carry have been increasingly challenging restrictions on their rights. They made headlines recently for visiting Starbucks while armed.

President Barack Obama approved a law in February allowing people to carry loaded guns in national parks, reversing a law originally signed by President Ronald Reagan.

“The speed at which guns laws are being relaxed is increasing,” said John Pierce, a co-founder of OpenCarry.org. “We’re very happy about it.”

It doesn’t please Daniel Vice, lead attorney for the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence.

“Now you can openly carry an assault weapon into a national park,” he said. “Before, national parks had the lowest crime rates in the nation. Since this law passed, two people were shot and one died in a national park in Virginia. Even if a park ranger had seen this person with a shotgun, he couldn’t do anything.”

Vice said having guns around increases the chance of a tragedy.

Meleanie Hain of Lebanon made national headlines two years ago when she carried a gun to her 5-year-old daughter’s soccer game in a Lebanon park. She became a symbol for open-carry advocates when the sheriff took away her concealed-weapons permit. He later returned it and she sued him.

Hain was shot to death in October by her husband in a murder-suicide.

“We see that a lot. When guns are around, they lead to violence,” Vice said. “Having a gun in a domestic dispute greatly increases the chance of a shooting.”

Pierce said Hain died because of a domestic situation, “not because she chose to carry a firearm.”

Pennsylvania, like 27 others, is an “open-carry” state, meaning people older than 18 don’t need a license to openly carry a loaded gun. A license is required for a concealed weapon. Only people prohibited by law from owning guns — mostly those with criminal backgrounds or mental instabilities — cannot carry. The only places open carry is banned under state law are schools, courthouses, Philadelphia, secure areas of airports and state parks.

Many midstate municipalities have laws on their books prohibiting guns in their parks, including Susquehanna Township, Harrisburg, Camp Hill and Derry Township.

Lower Paxton Township manager George Wolf said the township has no such law, but guns are among the restrictions listed on signs at the park entries. He said the township will most likely change its signs in light of the Upper Allen decision.

Most municipal officials were cautious about commenting on the law. Several were not sure if their ordinances prohibit guns in parks or not.

Mike Pries, chairman of the Derry Township supervisors, said the subject has never come up, but township officials will take a look at it.

Lower Swatara Township has never had a law banning guns in its parks because “we follow state law, period” and there has never been a gun incident in a township park, Police Chief Richard Wiley said.

But he thinks the state law is “crazy.”

“I’m not a proponent,” he said. “You get people who are not properly trained, or there is a chance a criminal could take a gun off a citizen.”

Franklin Linn, chairman of the Lower Swatara commissioners, said people who openly carry loaded guns in public places are showing off.

“I believe in the right to carry arms, but I hesitate because it could scare children in public parks,” he said.

While the 117 state parks still prohibit open carry, a change in the law in 2008 allows people with concealed-weapons permits to carry their guns there, said Ryan Dysinger, chief of the operations and training center of the Bureau of State Parks. Hunters, where hunting is allowed, have always been allowed to carry guns.

Dysinger said there have been no complaints since the law was changed.

“One year from now, everyone will be carrying in the parks and it will be a normal part of everyday life,” Pierce said.

Another one, from 2007 (Peters Township, Washington County)

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07207/804282-55.stm

Council accused of breaking law for firearms ban
Thursday, July 26, 2007
By Janice Crompton, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Several dozen angry residents and gun rights advocates filled the Peters Council meeting Monday, asking council to reconsider an ordinance unanimously passed at its July 9 meeting that bans firearms and other dangerous weapons from township parks and most township-owned buildings.

Council members were accused of breaking the law, facilitating criminal activity, and defying the U.S. Constitution for establishing the ban, which came about after a resident carried a concealed handgun into a heated zoning hearing board meeting.

Although the resident didn't brandish or threaten to use the weapon, a board member felt intimidated when he spotted the gun, which the resident had a license to carry.

Peters already had a law on the books banning the discharge of weapons on township property.

Resident and former Councilman Peter Glasser told council he felt they'd created "free crime zones," because concealed weapons kept remote walking trails safe, while Judy Brown of the Second Amendment Sisters gave council a history lesson on Second Amendment rights. The group represents women who own firearms.

Ms. Brown questioned what constituted a "dangerous weapon," also banned from township property.

Ron Boocks, 21, asked council to rescind the ordinance, saying he frequently uses walking trails alone and citing statistics that show firearm ownership reduces crime.

Allegheny County Sportsmen's League, Inc. legislative committee Chairman Kim Stolfer told council it broke the law and may have committed a misdemeanor by passing the ordinance.

"The Pennsylvania Crimes Code makes it illegal to enact ordinances of this type," Mr. Stolfer said.

He said his organization wanted to work with the township to find a better solution and asked council to revisit the issue.

Under Pennsylvania law, residents who hold a license to carry firearms are permitted to possess and transport them anywhere in the state except onto school property or courthouse facilities. A specific provision in the state law prohibits counties and municipalities from regulating the possession, ownership or transportation of firearms.

Nonetheless, council moved forward with the ordinance because several governmental entities have challenged the law with mixed results, including Jefferson County, which successfully banned firearms from county offices because they were located in the same facility as the courthouse.

However, on Monday, Councilwoman Patricia Moore, the only Democrat on council, said a legal adviser told her the ordinance in Peters probably wouldn't stand up in court.

Councilman David Ball, a National Rifle Association member, told audience members council was trying to consider the safety of people in meetings and at parks.

"Our hearts were in the right place," he said.

Mr. Ball proposed council put the ordinance on hold for now, until more research on the issue could be conducted. The proposal was unanimously approved by 5-0. Councilmen James Berquist and Robert Lewis were absent.

First published at PG NOW on July 25, 2007 at 2:22 pm
Janice Crompton can be reached at jcrompton@post-gazette.com or 724-223-0156.

Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07207...#ixzz0raltt24g

t1m0thy's work in Edensburg:
http://tribune-democrat.com/local/x3...-ban-shot-down

March 28, 2010
Boro’s gun ban shot down
Susan Evans The Tribune-Democrat

EBENSBURG — An Ebensburg man challenged the borough’s ban on carrying guns in town parks – and won.

On the advice of the borough solicitor, who reviewed Timothy L. Havener’s complaint and agreed with it, Borough Council members on March 22 deleted the language prohibiting firearms in parks.

That means gun-toters, if permitted for other locations, also will be allowed at locations such as Ebensburg’s tennis courts, swimming pool, Lake Rowena and the town’s small parks.

“We didn’t know,” said borough Manager Dan Penatzer. “We thought the borough had the right to regulate firearms in a government building or facility, but it’s only in a building with some kind of court facility, like even a holding cell.

“Apparently that means someone could show up at a council meeting carrying a gun, and there’s nothing we could do about it if it’s otherwise legal.”

Havener has an unlisted telephone number and could not be reached for comment, but he explained his challenge in a Feb. 17 letter to borough officials.

“No county, municipality or township may in any manner regulate the lawful ownership, possession, transfer, or transportation of firearms, ammunition or ammunition components when carried or transported for purposes not prohibited by the laws of this Commonwealth,” he quoted the Pennsylvania Uniform Firearms Act as saying.

Havener argued that the borough’s laws were in violation because they prohibited carrying firearms in parks or recreation areas.

“I feel obligated to disclose this information to my local government officials and ask that they rewrite the ordinance in question so that they comply with the state mandate concerning the right of citizens to carry firearms,” he said in his letter to the borough.

Specifically on March 22 council members deleted the language prohibiting firearms and agreed to advertise the changed ordinance for public inspection.

Ebensburg is not the only local government facing challenges to bans on guns in parks.

Last month a Seattle rule banning firearms from city parks was struck down in a King County Court action applauded by the National Rifle Association, which was a party to the lawsuit.

An ordinance in Elwood City banning guns in government buildings was struck down last year after a challenge by the National Rifle Association.

Gun activists point out that many states, including Pennsylvania, have adequate controls on gun ownership, and Pennsylvania law prohibits firearms in court and in school buildings.

Discussions of weapons at recreation sites often in Pennsylvania invoke reminders of the Lebanon soccer mom, Meleanie Hain, who made headlines in 2008 by bringing a loaded, holstered handgun to her daughter’s soccer game and was a year later found shot dead.

Here is the original article and the response I just received from the publisher of the paper:

[tommy610]

I don't get why they have to see precedent. The definition of the preemption violation is pretty clear. Oh well. I guess anything to drag their feet. Way to go GL23. Reps a 'comin.

[anonymouse]

Re: Upper Allen Township. Here's their public notice about changing the ordinance:
http://www.mypublicnotices.com/PennL...e&AdId=1919892

NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN THAT THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS OF
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN THAT THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS OF UPPER ALLEN TOWNSHIP, CUMBERLAND COUNTY, PENNSYLVANIA, WILL CONSIDER THE ENACTMENT AND ADOPTION OF THE FOLLOWING ORDINANCE AT A MEETING OF SAID BOARD TO BE HELD ON JUNE 2, 2010, AT 6:30 P.M. AT THE TOWNSHIP OFFICES, 100 GETTYSBURG PIKE, MECHANICSBURG, PENNSYLVANIA.

ORDINANCE NO.___ _____

AN ORDINANCE OF THE TOWNSHIP OF UPPER ALLEN, COUNTY OF CUMBERLAND AND COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA, TO AMEND THE PARKS AND RECREATION ORDINANCE, ENACTED 12 NOVEMBER 1975, CHAPTER 175 OF THE CODE OF THE TOWNSHIP OF UPPER ALLEN, SECTION 175-6.

WHEREAS, the Board of Commissioners of Upper Allen Township ("Board") on 12 November 1975, enacted Ordinance No. 222, entitled Parks and Recreation Ordinance, now Chapter 175 of the Code of Upper Allen; and

WHEREAS, Section 175-6 lists a number of activities that are restricted to occur on Upper Allen Township park land without the expressed prior approval of the Parks and Recreation Board; and

WHEREAS, item F within Section 175-6 specifically restricts the carrying of firearms within the parks or playgrounds of the Township; and

WHEREAS, the Pennsylvania Uniform Firearms Act, 18 Pa.C.S.A. § 6120(a) expressly preempts township regulation of the lawful ownership, possession, transfer or transportation of firearms, ammunition or ammunition components when carried or transported for purposes not prohibited by the laws of the Commonwealth;

WHEREAS, the Board of Commissioners desires to amend Section 175-6 to comply with the provisions of the Uniform Firearms Act and to regulate the use of paintball guns and paintball markers in said parks and playgrounds;

WHEREAS, item G within Section 175-6 specifically restricts camping or sleeping overnight on the ground or elsewhere within parks owned by Upper Allen Township without the expressed prior approval of the Parks and Recreation Board; and

WHEREAS, the Board of Commissioners desires to amend Section 175-6 to expedite the review and approval of camping requests, by delegating routine review and approval to the Township administrative staff.

NOW THEREFORE, BE IT ENACTED AND ORDAINED by the Board of Commissioners of Upper Allen Township, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, and it is hereby enacted and ordained by authority of the same:

SECTION 1: The first sentence of Section 175-6 is hereby amended to provide as follows: "No person shall perform the following actions within parks or playgrounds without having previously obtained written consent and approval of the Board or where specifically noted the Township Manager/Assistant Township manager:"

SECTION 2: Subsection 175-6.F is hereby amended to provide as follows: "Carry or discharge an air rifle, an air pistol, paintball gun or paintball marker, fireworks (including rockets), a slingshot or a bow and arrow, provided further that no person shall discharge any firearm within parks or playgrounds.

SECTION 3: Subsection 175-6.G is hereby amended to provide as follows: "Camp or sleep overnight on the ground or elsewhere. (Note: For this subsection, consent and approval can be obtained from either the Board or the Township Manager/Assistant Township Manager)."

SECTION 4: All ordinances or parts of ordinances which are inconsistent herewith are hereby repealed.

SECTION 5: This Ordinance shall become effective immediately.

This constitutes the Ordinance in its entirety.

Lou Fazekas, Township Manager
Upper Allen Township
100 Gettysburg Pike
Mechanicsburg, PA 17055]]>

Ran out of space in the other post:

More t1m0thy:
http://wearecentralpa.com/fulltext/?nxd_id=160605

Local Man Challenged His Communities Gun Ban… And Won.
Reported by: Danielle Krout
Monday, March 29 2010

Ebensburg, Cambria County--- Ebensburg Borough had a gun ban in place which prohibited gun owners from carrying their weapons in public places, but not anymore.

Timothy Havener challenged the borough’s ban stating it violated his rights as a gun owner, and he came out on top.

The borough agreed with Havener stating their ban did violate the states firearms codes that prohibits the local government from regulating firearms.

“Our legal department agreed with Mr. Havener and we were forced to amend that particular code,” said Borough Manager Dan Penatzer.

Westmoreland County (renegadephoenix's work)
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_676547.html

Guns may be allowed in parks
By Rich Cholodofsky
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Thursday, April 15, 2010

Westmoreland County commissioners are considering an ordinance that would legalize guns in county parks.

Officials said Wednesday the proposal would update a 1974 code that generally outlawed firearms at the parks but allowed guns in specific areas for hunting. Solicitor R. Mark Gesalman said that ordinance, amended in 1995, conflicts with a state law that permits guns in public places.

"In Pennsylvania, you cannot restrict somebody's right to carry a firearm, except in restricted areas like courthouses," Gesalman said.

The proposal strips existing language from the code that specifically bans guns from the parks. The revised ordinance would allow guns in all areas of county parks, but permits the discharge of firearms only in designated hunting areas.

The county allows hunting in six parks: Mammoth, Twin Lakes, Cedar Creek, Northmoreland, Bridgeport Dam and Chestnut Ridge.

Under the new ordinance, deer hunting in designated areas would be permitted with rifled slugs, muzzle-loaded rifles or bow and arrow. Small game and fur-bearing animals can be hunted only with shotguns or bow and arrow.

Nick Caesar, chief of the county's park police, said no citations for violating the firearms ordinance in the parks have been issued in decades.

"It's never really been an issue for us," Caesar said.

Violation of the ordinance carries a fine ranging from $25 to $600.

The impetus to change the ordinance came from gun advocates who have spent several months lobbying the commissioners for a revision.

Christopher Smith of Penn Township said he discovered Westmoreland's existing ordinance was out of compliance with state law while researching legalities for a meeting of Second Amendment advocates to be held April 24 at Twin Lakes Park.

"I don't want to see any citizen brought up on any charges because of that law," Smith said.

Kim Stolfer, chairman of the Firearms Owners Against Crimes, said the existing ordinance violates state law.

"It was a crime, and the people who enacted it committed a crime," he said.

The proposed ordinance is on display at the courthouse. The commissioners are slated to vote on it April 22 at their next meeting.

Westmoreland passed the ordinance (thanks renegadephoenix!!)
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_677752.html

Westmoreland commissioners allow guns in county parks
By Rich Cholodofsky
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Friday, April 23, 2010

Westmoreland County Commissioners voted yesterday to change an ordinance to allow guns in all county parks.

Commissioners Tom Balya and Tom Ceraso, both Democrats, said they had no choice but to amend the county's 1974 parks ordinance so it concurs with state law that allows firearms in public places, including parks.

"We would be foolish to try to keep an ordinance on the books that would not pass muster in court," Balya said yesterday after a handful of county residents both for and against the proposed ordinance change addressed the commissioners.

Republican Commissioner Charles Anderson did not attend yesterday's meeting and did not cast a vote.

The change approved removes wording from the original ordinance, which was amended in 1995, that banned firearms from specific areas of county parks. The revised law now carries no prohibitions of guns, but bans the discharge of firearms outside of designated hunting areas.

The county allows hunting in six parks: Mammoth, Twin Lakes, Cedar Creek, Northmoreland, Bridgeport Dam and Chestnut Ridge.

Gun opponents asked commissioners to table the proposal.

Marian Elizabeth Mientus of Norvelt told commissioners she will no longer take her goddaughter to the park because of the revised gun ordinance.

"I don't want anyone to fear for their children's safety in the recreation areas of the county parks. Why do we need more guns in our parks where we take our children to play? What is more important than our children's safety?" Mientus said.

Ann Moser of Ligonier told commissioners that allowing guns in the parks would encourage more dangerous activity and that she, too, feared for her children's safety as a result of the change.

"This ordinance is about white, angry men who enjoy looking menacing," Moser said.

Proponents of the ordinance change said it was needed to bring Westmoreland County into compliance with state law. For decades, the Westmoreland County park police have virtually ignored the prohibition on guns in the parks and issued no citations to anyone with a firearm.

Chris Smith of Penn Township lobbied commissioners to pass the change. Smith is holding a rally in favor of the Second Amendment this weekend at Twin Lakes Park and said he began researching the gun issue to ensure those attending could legally take their firearms into the park during the event.

"This gun rights issue was never a rally about gun rights. It was about the county adhering to state law," Smith said.

Commissioners said the revised ordinance will have little or no effect on park visitors.

"We could not have enforced an ordinance that was unlawful in our commonwealth," Ceraso said.

[anonymouse]

... reserving space for more articles ...

Edit: See page 3

[renegadephoenix]

Here are the links to both of the news articles for Westmoreland Co.

Pre hearing:
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_676547.html

Post hearing:
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_677752.html

[rockkrawler628]

I Just watched the video... It seems to me that they blew you off, and the issue isn't important to them... You did good in holding your temper, I think I would have been a little upset that they are breaking the law and it's not important to them.
I would have brought a copy of the PA Uniform Firearms Act so they could have taken a look right then and there; however, they prolly wouldn't have since its not important to them!

Thanks for going and supporting our rights, even though I don't live in Radnor and this doesn't neccessarily effect me. Good luck!

[anonymouse]

I Just watched the video... It seems to me that they blew you off, and the issue isn't important to them... You did good in holding your temper, I think I would have been a little upset that they are breaking the law and it's not important to them.
I would have brought a copy of the PA Uniform Firearms Act so they could have taken a look right then and there; however, they prolly wouldn't have since its not important to them!

Thanks for going and supporting our rights, even though I don't live in Radnor and this doesn't neccessarily effect me. Good luck!

Radnor is VERY familiar with §6120. They just want to be difficult.

Video:

Starts at 42:30 until 46:00

Mr. Rice, just because other townships are violating the law, doesn't mean you are allowed to do it also.


"It hasn't been addressed in this type of environment."

What the fuck? What part of the definition of possession differs when you're in a public park?