IUP Campus Police to Carry Guns

[avizpls]

Here is a link to the full story From the school paper at IUP. This is a snippet that caught my attention

SGA forum addresses issue of arming police
Rachael Parker
Issue date: 10/13/06 Section: News



Cole Hood (senior, sociology) read a letter on behalf of Students for a Democratic Society and Indiana Voices for Peace and presented it to Montgomery and Burdette as segues to the Council of Trustees. The letter stated that the groups will be in contact with the National Rifle Association and national media and will begin a campaign for students to secure permits to carry concealed weapons.

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My comments are about the bold part in particular. WHAT THE HECK?

• First, what is the motivation for these organizations to be doing that? I believe they are so convinced that it is absurd for a student to be carrying a gun that they use it to illustrate the following syllogism:
  
  If Campus police can carry a gun, then students should be able to. Since it is absurd for students to be able to carry a gun, then it is also absurd for campus police to do so.
  
  I do not believe for a second that these organizations desire to actually help students carry weapons without fear of punishment by the university.
  
  
• my second point is that students CAN carry, and that the school rules are unlawful. Even if thier intentions are good, the school does not need to institute a liscensing system. They just need to eliminate the rule prohibiting firearms on campus!
  
  Read this law:
  

  § 6120. Limitation on the regulation of firearms and ammunition.
  (a) General rule.--No county, municipality or township may in any manner regulate the lawful ownership, possession, transfer or transportation of firearms, ammunition or ammunition components when carried or transported for purposes not prohibited by the laws of this Commonwealth.
  <>
  (b) Definitions.--As used in this section, the following words and phrases shall have the meanings given to them in this subsection:
  <>
  "Political subdivision."
  The term shall include any home rule charter municipality, county, city, borough, incorporated town, township or school district.

  
  Since IUP is a state funded school, do they have a right to regulate weapons on campus? They are. Its not a state of federal law that would keep students from lawfully carrying concealed on campus, its University policy. You will be expelled or punished academically some way. I'm not sure this is legal, but I’m not sure its not either. I understand the concept of private property, and that if Joes House of Hot Dogs doesn’t want you on their premises with a gun, that they can ask you to leave. If you refuse, you can be charged with trespassing. I do not think that a state funded school has this same right.
  
• Lastly, given the situation outlined above, how is a student who advocates lawful concealed carry to do anything? If he wants to speak up, then he probably understands the fundamental right and necessity for self-protection. If he speaks up, however, he will be placed under scrutiny and be forced to choose between possible expulsion, and allowing himself to be disarmed by a policy that he believes is wrong.

[billamj]

First, if the SDS is involved, then there are many more questions than answers. They are not known for being one of the more law abiding on campus groups. As far as legally carrying on campus, we have both state and federal laws that do not allow carry on campuses except by LEOs, so that is a completely moot point.

[avizpls]

As far as legally carrying on campus, we have both state and federal laws that do not allow carry on campuses except by LEOs, so that is a completely moot point.

cite them, please.

[dgg9]

cite them, please.

Yeah, I'm very sure there's no PA state law to this effect.

[billamj]

Under section 912 possesion of a weapon on school property is unlawful. You can find it on the State Police web site.

[dgg9]

Under section 912 possesion of a weapon on school property is unlawful. You can find it on the State Police web site.

BZZZT!

Unlawful for primary and secondary schools (K-12) -- NOT colleges.

[billamj]

I wish it were so, but from what a few of my local LEOs are telling me, at least at state owned colleges and universities as well as the lower level schools. Of course they could be wrong, but I'm not going to push the point if that is how they are being trained.

[dgg9]

I wish it were so, but from what a few of my local LEOs are telling me, at least at state owned colleges and universities as well as the lower level schools. Of course they could be wrong, but I'm not going to push the point if that is how they are being trained.

The law says what the law says.

Primary/secondary is not college.

[billamj]

I can only tell you what I've been advised, as I said they could be wrong, but since I have a family to take care of, I'm not willing to push the point.

Additionally, a college is not any type of political subdivision and as such can and will create policy to "protect" the students. We all know that business can create a policy whereby you can not carry on their property, this could be construed to fall under the same type of auspicies. I'm not saying that I agree with the policy, however I understand the policies and the laws as they have been explained to me by members of various police agencies.

[billamj]

Let me rephrase. Even if the LEOs who gave me the information were incorrect, there are still private property rights that would allow the college/university the right to ban student posession or carry of firearms on campus.