Need your help...

[NikeBauer21]

Long story short, I had posted in this thread http://forum.pafoa.org/national-11/1...ml#post1233605 post #42, about how some of my friends and family have been acting recently...

Originally Posted by B2Luv2Hunt View Post
It will not matter if we continue to go like we are. I know many hunters who only think of hunting and we are running into them while fighting preemption in our area. As long as it does not affect them they do not care if others lose. Until we all stand together we will continue to go down hill.

That's a huge problem. I love hunting, and I go every year. But I also love supporting my 2a right to carry. It absolutely annoys me when I'm carrying among friends and family that are hunters, but they berate me because I carry, or treat me like a retard. "Why do you need to carry around here?" I tell them the exact same answer every time... it's no use saying anything else, I just treat them like little kids. Or they treat me like I know nothing. "Watch yourself with that... once the bullet leaves, you can't bring it back." Well thank you captain obvious. I have more training, situational awareness, and gun safety knowledge then you, so why do you feel the need to degrade me again? Let's just sit here and flex our man-muscles and try to act tough in front of everyone else, and beat the guy who actually does know something about the subject matter.

It get's really old. We should be united in the cause, and instead, there's a division between gun owners. It's truly selfish for the primarily-hunters to only care about their rights for hunting. They are ignorant to the fact that any legislation that hurts the gun movement in general, hurts them. Give me the old "They just want to get rid of semi-auto weapons.. I don't have any, or need any to hunt." Well, guess what. You're guns are next.. and then it WILL be you're problem. But by then, the division between us will have destroyed us.

“There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.” - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Well, it happened again this weekend, and I can't tell you just how much it's pissing me off. I have been constantly berated, and treated like a retarded child lately. I'm very responsible with firearms, I would say the most out of all of my friends and family. I have done as much as I can to learn, train, and remain aware. But in return, people just choose to take cheap shots at my desire to protect myself.

We live in a fairly rural setting... small town kinda thing. And we go camping a lot where again, it's very rural obviously. Now, they make the typical remarks such as "Do you really think you need that around here", and "Maybe that's why you don't have a girlfriend right now", and other smartass stuff..

So here's what I want to do... I want to compile a stack of stories I can print out, and throw down in front of them... stories that involve people having to defend themselves in "rural" settings... People on walks getting attacked by animals... people in tents/trailers getting attacked by animals, or robbed... anything that you feel would pertain to the topic of proving to them why one would need to carry, even in a more "rural", nice area. Both successful defense stories, unsuccessful, whatever...

I will be leaving next weekend for a few days, so I want to be able to throw a stack down in front of them before I go, to give them some reading material.

To everyone that helps me, I'll give you some rep... I'll certainly be googling and looking, but I need your help to compile a nice, big list... the more minds the better!

Thanks for your help. It's a shame I need to do this, because my family has been involved in firearms for decades... but they just can't get through their heads of why I need it "around here"...

[gnbrotz]

http://www.herald-mail.com/?cmd=disp...83&format=html

State Line, Pa., woman killed in her home
By DON AINES and HEATHER KEELS
August 28, 2007
chambersburg@herald-mail.com

STATE LINE, Pa. - The manhunt for Paul G. Devoe stretched from Texas to Long Island, N.Y., where he was captured Monday, and the U.S. Marshals Service said his trail took him to an isolated dead end road in Franklin County, where an 81-year-old widow was found shot dead in her home.

Pennsylvania State Police found the body of Betty Jane Dehart, of 15349 North Young Road, Monday afternoon, about three hours after Devoe, 43, was captured in Shirley, N.Y. Dehart died of an apparent single gunshot wound to the head, said Lenny DePaul, commander of the U.S. Marshals Service New York-New Jersey Regional Fugitive Task Force.

Neighbors familiar with the few people living on the road that parallels Interstate 81 in Antrim Township said they saw an unfamiliar white station wagon drive down the road Saturday afternoon, and then saw Dehart's small blue car driven away Sunday morning, although they were not sure who was behind the wheel.

On Monday night, a white Saturn station wagon with Texas plates was loaded onto a rollback truck and driven from the crime scene.

Devoe, who is a suspect in five killings in Texas, has family in Long Island, DePaul said, and the Marshal's Service "did a full-court press throughout the night and into today," conducting interviews and surveillance. Devoe was found at the home of someone he knew. When asked if anyone else was in the house, that person said Devoe was inside.

DePaul said Devoe was taken into custody without incident at about 12:30 p.m. Monday and was armed with a handgun. The Associated Press reported a brief standoff at the house.

Devoe was being held by the Suffolk County (N.Y.) Police Department, according to a U.S. Marshals Service statement.

After Devoe was taken into custody, the blue car with Pennsylvania registration was found in the driveway of the house and traced to Dehart, DePaul said.

"We got a call at about 3 p.m.," Pennsylvania State Police Trooper Ed Asbury said Monday night. Troopers were sent to the house and discovered the car with Texas registration.

"A check was done and it came back stolen," Asbury said. "Troopers then knocked at the door, made entry and found the victim."

There was no sign of a struggle, Asbury said.

DePaul said the vehicle found at Dehart's home was stolen from one of the homicide victims in Texas.

Devoe was charged with murder in the Friday slaying of a bartender in Marble Falls, Texas, and on a federal charge of unlawful flight to avoid prosecution, said Supervisory Deputy U.S. Marshal Hector Gomez. Marble Falls is about 20 miles from where four people were found dead near Jonestown, Texas.

The bartender at O'Neill's bar, Michael Allred, was shot trying to stop Devoe from shooting two women, according to a Marshals Service statement.

Investigators found four bodies near Austin on Sunday evening after a relative called police to check on a family member's welfare at the home, Travis County sheriff's spokesman Roger Wade said.

He did not release the identities, ages or genders of the homicide victims. Medical examiners were working Monday on positively identifying the four victims and pinpointing the causes of death, Wade said.

Dehart lived in a small mobile home visible from Interstate 81 through a chain-link fence. Neighbors said she lived there alone.

Randy Runshaw, who lives near the entrance to North Young Street, said he saw the white station wagon turn in around 4 p.m. Saturday. He remembers noticing the Texas license plate.

"I just thought it was weird because I've never seen the car here," he said. "It's a dead-end street, so you get to know who comes in here."

Runshaw also said he saw Dehart's little blue car leave the neighborhood when he went outside to let his dogs out Sunday morning, sometime between 7 and 8:30 a.m.

He remembers waving, assuming it was Dehart, but doesn't remember seeing her in the car. Thinking back on the moment, he said the car was going a little faster than it normally does.

Runshaw watched Monday evening as police cars made their way down the winding country road to the mobile home, which sits about a quarter-mile from the entrance. As the orange lights of a tow truck approached, he pointed to the white Saturn station wagon with Texas plates being removed from the property and said, "That's it."

Deb Allamong, who has lived on North Young Street for 14 years, said Dehart was a cancer survivor who kept to herself. She said she was independent and could still drive. She recently bought the blue car, Allamong said.

"It's a shame," Allamong said. "She's a real nice lady - very friendly. She would always wave."

Allamong and Runshaw said they were shaken by the incident.

"That's scary, to live in a neighborhood like this and there's a murder right here," Allamong said.

"It's a wonder he wasn't trying to knock on our door to get our car," Runshaw said.

[twoeggsup]

You might find some stories that you can use on The Armed Citizen, but honestly you may find they won't read them or won't care. You're dealing with a mob mentality where one or more loudmouths pick on one person and the others to be part of the group join in and continue the badgering. It happens in grade schools and it happens in families because often the maturity level of the two is about the same.

Beyond just ignoring the foolishness, the best course might be simple responses to their 'objections'.

Probably among the crowd, there is at least one who keeps a bunch of hand tools, flares, flashlights etc in their vehicle 'just in case'. If so, point out that if they really believed that bad things can't happen anywhere or anytime they would remove all such things including the spare tire and jack. Since they don't believe in bad things why do they carry around all that crap and get worse gas mileage because of it.

Tell them to remove all fire extinguishers and smoke detectors from their homes if they believe bad things don't happen anywhere, anytime.

"Why do you carry a handgun, do you think something bad is going to happen?"
Answer: Nope, if I thought something bad was going to happen I would have a rifle and a shotgun.

[newskate9]

I was going to suggest Armed Citizen too - it's a great site.

A few years ago when I started getting into guns, my father wasn't all that pleased, but he wasn't too vocal about it either. Over time, I forwarded quite a few articles to him, and we talk about "rights" quite a bit. Now, he's still no fan of guns himself, but he sends ME articles and info all the time.

If you can't get them to come even a little, maybe a cup-o-coffee, 1 on 1, "Look, this is who I am, and I know who you are.......... let's leave it at that, and leave the comments at out of it.........."

[JGeezer1986]

just hand them a flyer and walk away. I have found that it is almost impossible to change the mind of someone who is totally againt guns. I say your best fight in this battle is to not fight it at all.. The only thing you will probably get out of them is acceptance, if that.. Dont worry about them. You can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink.

[PocketProtector]

That's the answer right there

[GunLawyer001]

Just assure them that if they are ever in trouble, you will respect their wishes and decline to help them. God forbid that they'd be attacked and you'd embarrass them by proving that you were right and they were wrong.

[God's Country]

Personally I wouldn't waste my time. Your friends/family are, as you pointed out, the reason we will some day lose. The enemy is within our ranks. Always been the case.

FWIW the big little town around here is Bradford. There have been two murders this year (domestic related), which is big news for this area.
Last year a couple punks were running around robbing gas stations.
I'm basically on the edge of the planet by Pa standards. It doesn't get more Pennsyltucky. People carry around here.

[shadowcat187]

I am in the same situation with family/ and friends just not understanding. my reply when they make smart ass remarks is simply "because it is my right".

compiling a list of situations will more than likely be a waste because of their mentality. unless it happens to them they couldnt care less. My fiance and i ran into a situation that completely changed her mind and she doesnt "seriously" harass me about carrying her anymore. Her mother..........thats a different story.......she just doesnt understand.

[Metz]

Good luck, man!

One of the main reasons of me carrying around the house is the idea, that I'll feel like a complete moron if [god forbid] shit hits the fan and the last thought of mine will be: "Jeez, I wish I have my gun with me..."