Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Few questions on stand your ground and castle doctrin.

    Does an act 235 officer have the duty to retreat when in uniform even if not at the place of work? An example would be going out to lunch or stopping to and from work?

    Would a public property type employer count as not having to retreat if you are carrying a weapon at that job? Would it still have the exception of not having to retreat?

    If someone breaks in your house and does not have a weapon can you hold a gun on them? I was worried an intruder would break in and would attack me when I have a rifle and he has nothing. Is there any case law on Pa house break ins where the intruder was unarmed and shot?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Few questions on stand your ground and castle doctrin.

    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaState View Post
    Does an act 235 officer have the duty to retreat when in uniform even if not at the place of work? An example would be going out to lunch or stopping to and from work?

    Would a public property type employer count as not having to retreat if you are carrying a weapon at that job? Would it still have the exception of not having to retreat? There are only private and public properties in PA. Public is owned by the people through a level of government(iearks, municipal lands/bldgs, public roads via RoW or parcel). Private is owned by individuals, trusts, corporations, etc(homes, yards, stores, businesses, etc, etc).

    If someone breaks in your house and does not have a weapon can you hold a gun on them? I was worried an intruder would break in and would attack me when I have a rifle and he has nothing. Is there any case law on Pa house break ins where the intruder was unarmed and shot?
    Act 235 does not change the requirements for use of force. As a security guard, your requirements on the use of force and deadly force are the same as any other person. You must be in fear of death/serious bodily injury/rape/kidnapping, or to stop the commission of a crime in which said offenses could occur.

    A guard could stand his ground at his place of work. Elsewhere he'd have to follow the rule of retreat if he could do so in complete safety.

    Yes, you may hold someone at gun point after breaking into your home. In PA a person may effect a common law arrest on those who have a warrant sworn out upon them, for felonies that you have reason to believe to been committed, and for breaches of the peace that you personally have witnessed. To use deadly force even within your home or place of work you still need to be in fear of death/serious bodily injury/rape/kidnapping, or to stop the commission of a felony within the dwelling after there has been an unlawful entry. There is case law on the matter. Having a weapon has no bearing, it only helps form a justification.
    Last edited by knight0334; June 5th, 2010 at 10:35 AM.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J., PennsyPlinker, Statkowski, Deanimator, roland, aubie515

    Don't end up in my signature!

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Few questions on stand your ground and castle doctrin.

    Can you use deadly foce in Pa to stop the commission of a felony? I know burglary is a Felony so that alone might be enough. My fear is having one guy who is smaller than me break in my house and have no weapons. A jury might look down on the me since I fired at him.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Few questions on stand your ground and castle doctrin.

    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaState View Post
    Can you use deadly foce in Pa to stop the commission of a felony? I know burglary is a Felony so that alone might be enough. My fear is having one guy who is smaller than me break in my house and have no weapons. A jury might look down on the me since I fired at him.
    First of.. DO NOT just shoot intruders.. If you are grasping at straws on justification in popping a cap in someone I will be the first to testify against you. Only do so when in fear of life, limb, rape, or kidnapping.

    For just any felony outside of one's dwelling - NO.

    Burglary in itself is a crime, but it requires intent to commit or the actual commission of a crime after unlawfully entering to be burglary. Just merely unlawfully entering IS NOT burglary.


    18 Pa.C.S.A.§ 3502. Burglary

    (a) Offense defined.--A person is guilty of burglary if he enters a building or occupied structure, or separately secured or occupied portion thereof, with intent to commit a crime therein, unless the premises are at the time open to the public or the actor is licensed or privileged to enter.

    (b) Defense.--It is a defense to prosecution for burglary that the building or structure was abandoned.

    (c) Grading.--

    (1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), burglary is a felony of the first degree.
    (2) If the building, structure or portion entered is not adapted for overnight accommodation and if no individual is present at the time of entry, burglary is a felony of the second degree.

    (d) Multiple convictions.--A person may not be convicted both for burglary and for the offense which it was his intent to commit after the burglarious entry or for an attempt to commit that offense, unless the additional offense constitutes a felony of the first or second degree.



    Here is the rule for the use of deadly force to protect property:


    18 Pa.C.S. § 507: Use of force for the protection of property
    (c) Limitations on justifiable use of force.--
    (4) (i) The use of deadly force is justifiable under this section if:
    (A) there has been an entry into the actor's dwelling;
    (B) the actor neither believes nor has reason to believe that the entry is lawful; and
    (C) the actor neither believes nor has reason to believe that force less than deadly force would be adequate to terminate the entry.
    (ii) If the conditions of justification provided in subparagraph (i) have not been met, the use of deadly force is not justifiable under this section unless the actor believes that:
    (A) the person against whom the force is used is attempting to dispossess him of his dwelling otherwise than under a claim of right to its possession; or
    (B) such force is necessary to prevent the commission of a felony in the dwelling.


    Here is the law on using deadly force to stop a crime:


    18 Pa.C.S. § 508: Use of force in law enforcement

    (d) Use of force to prevent suicide or the commission of crime.--
    (1) The use of force upon or toward the person of another is justifiable when the actor believes that such force is immediately necessary to prevent such other person from committing suicide, inflicting serious bodily injury upon himself, committing or consummating the commission of a crime involving or threatening bodily injury, damage to or loss of property or a breach of the peace, except that:
    (i) Any limitations imposed by the other provisions of this chapter on the justifiable use of force in self-protection, for the protection of others, the protection of property, the effectuation of an arrest or the prevention of an escape from custody shall apply notwithstanding the criminality of the conduct against which such force is used.
    (ii) The use of deadly force is not in any event justifiable under this subsection unless:
    (A) the actor believes that there is a substantial risk that the person whom he seeks to prevent from committing a crime will cause death or serious bodily injury to another unless the commission or the consummation of the crime is prevented and that the use of such force presents no substantial risk of injury to innocent persons; or
    (B) the actor believes that the use of such force is necessary to suppress a riot or mutiny after the rioters or mutineers have been ordered to disperse and warned, in any particular manner that the law may require, that such force will be used if they do not obey.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J., PennsyPlinker, Statkowski, Deanimator, roland, aubie515

    Don't end up in my signature!

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