Tresspassing signs on your property?

[Xringshooter]

Several things. IIRC Posted/No trespassing signs do hold weight, unlike a no guns sign in a store. If your land is posted and someone is trespassing and you call the police, the police can arrest them. The signs are already telling them they are not allowed on your land (just like being told to leave a store and do not come back). This happened to the hunting camp I belong to (the people were on our land and we told them to leave and they didn't). We called the police and they arrested them on the spot after we told them what happened. The police asked them if they saw the signs (they did) and told the people that the signs were just like someone verbally telling you to stay off the land.

You CANNOT brandish/use a gun unless your life is being threatened. If they are stealing your property you still cannot use a gun, again unless your life is being threatened. Now if you have a gun in a holster and it can be seen (open carrying, which is perfectly legal) that may deter someone, but don't draw unless you fear for your life and then all the rules of when you can use lethal force come into play.

[Pro2A]

Wouldn't the 'Castle Doctrine" clear all this up?

[Philadelphia]

Wouldn't the 'Castle Doctrine" clear all this up?

If you're talking about the proposal to write a presumption into the law that someone breaking into your house isn't coming in to give you a publisher's clearing house check (but intends to do you serious harm at the least), I don't think so. Under that law, it would still need to be in your house.

[jerkin]

What if someone stands outside my house and calls my wife ugly, can I shoot them? What if they kick my dog, can I shoot them? What if my neighbors lawn mower kicks up a rock and dings my car, not any old car but my brand new car, can I shoot him? What if I see someone OCing on my road, can I shoot them? What if a bunch of Jehovahs Witnesses come to my door, can I shoot them? What if the cable guy is in my house and won't give me a free Tivo, can I shoot him? What if I have a no turn around sign in my driveway and some one turns around, can I shoot them? What if someone continually drives too fast down the road where my kids ride bikes, can I shoot them? What if someone flips me the bird at a traffic light, can I shoot them?

OK, sorry about the sarcasm but come on guys, is someone on your property or even walking away with your property an imminent danger to your life? No, they are not. This isn't Texas, unless you reasonably believe your life is in danger you can not shoot anyone. Even if you believe your life was in danger and you shoot you had better be able to prove it. Pulling your weapon is always a last resort to save a life.

[phill]

OLD Air Police training do not draw it unless you intend to use it. Do not use it unless you intend to kill them.

[larrymeyer]

What if someone stands outside my house and calls my wife ugly, can I shoot them? What if they kick my dog, can I shoot them? What if my neighbors lawn mower kicks up a rock and dings my car, not any old car but my brand new car, can I shoot him? What if I see someone OCing on my road, can I shoot them? What if a bunch of Jehovahs Witnesses come to my door, can I shoot them? What if the cable guy is in my house and won't give me a free Tivo, can I shoot him? What if I have a no turn around sign in my driveway and some one turns around, can I shoot them? What if someone continually drives too fast down the road where my kids ride bikes, can I shoot them? What if someone flips me the bird at a traffic light, can I shoot them?

OK, sorry about the sarcasm but come on guys, is someone on your property or even walking away with your property an imminent danger to your life? No, they are not. This isn't Texas, unless you reasonably believe your life is in danger you can not shoot anyone. Even if you believe your life was in danger and you shoot you had better be able to prove it. Pulling your weapon is always a last resort to save a life.

It never stops amazing me people want to shot just to shot a person !!! And these people carry guns. If you don't know when you can draw and shot leave your gun at home because you will just get your ass in trouble. If you want to see what it feels like to shot a person I suggest you go to Iraq. Or to any army hospital and see the PTS patients there

OLD Air Police training do not draw it unless you intend to use it. Do not use it unless you intend to kill them.

Learn that a little different when I was about nine. Was always told "never point a gun at anything you don't intend to shoot. Even if the gun is unload as no gun is ever unloaded."

[str8shooter]

...OK, sorry about the sarcasm but come on guys, is someone on your property or even walking away with your property an imminent danger to your life? No, they are not. This isn't Texas, unless you reasonably believe your life is in danger you can not shoot anyone. Even if you believe your life was in danger and you shoot you had better be able to prove it. Pulling your weapon is always a last resort to save a life.

Point taken. The reason I asked is because I remembered this thread about a guy running for office who chased and tackled someone for stealing his campaign signs, and then held him at gun point until the cops came. The guy claimed the thief looked like he was reaching in his pocket for a weapon - after he was on the ground - so pulling his gun was justified, but just the fact that he chased him down the road and initiated the physical altercation had me wondering. In this case the police sided with the politician saying, if someone is bold enough to come on your property and steal stuff, what else are they capable of?

Drawing gun to defend property

What I took away from that thread was that if someone's on my property, I can go outside with a gun to investigate. If I think I see a weapon, or a movement that could be construed as going for a weapon, I'm justified in drawing my gun. Now to clarify my question on this thread, if I draw my gun based on thinking the thief might do me harm, but he just laughs at me as he wheels my 4 wheeler down the road, making no threatening moves and showing no weapon, do I have to put the gun down and say have a nice day? Can I whack him with the butt of a shotgun and then if he fights back, turn the gun around and point it at him? What are the options for protecting your property if a thief you know you can't physically overpower simply ignores you, other than getting a description to give to the police?

[tjefferson]

What about less than lethal?

TASER?
ASP baton?
Learn Judo?

[jerkin]

I see what you are getting at str8shooter and my response was not aimed at you or even at this thread in particular, it's just that is seems like every day there is another one about "am I justified" and many of these people don't seem to think that taking a life is a big deal.

The problem I see with your particular scenario is this, you would probably be justified in holding a thief at bay with your firearm until the police come. However, what if he gets scared and trys to disarm you and you shoot him? While you have a reasonable defense that he tried to attack you the whole encounter would have escalated from theft of property to someone dying. I wouldn't want to put myself or my family in the situation to defend my actions because of it.

All it would take is a single DA to find that you acted recklessly and you would be out thousands or even 10's of thousands of dollars fighting it and while you would probably be cleared in a jury trial, it is not a 100% guaranteed outcome.

As far as the politician thing goes, come on, you know by now that politicians are better than us regular citizens. They are allowed to do things like that.

[phill]

Commanding attitude and bright lights are the first stage. Most dirtbags will not stand up to firm commands to get your hands where I can see them, while blinded with a bright light. Most of the time if at night you will not take time to put on a holster so we were tought to hold the gun behind your leg.
The times that I know of that this has worked 100%.
Always remember that you will normally get what you expect.