Question on a battle rifle

[Jackal]

I am interested in buying a rifle in the future and I thought I'd post some questions here. What would be a good battle rifle?

I'm looking at something <$1000. 100-200 yards with high accuracy. Lethal rounds. And good in situations where maybe someone wouldnt have access to a cleaning kit or may have to abuse the hell out of the gun.

The AR type weapons, in my opinion, succeed with accuracy, price, lethality, but the maintenance issue has me somewhat concerned. From what I have read I wouldnt want to go to war with the thing. I know people will side with the AR but Stoner didn't have the whole 'adverse conditions' mindset when he made it. Again, my opinion.

The ak47 is good on price, reliability, but accuracy doesnt excite me that much. I was wondering if there were custom ak47's where they had been engineered a little differently so that the tolerances inside the gun werent as loose....hence a greater potential for accuracy. Also, is 7.62 needed or should I look for an AK gun in a dif caliber like .308 or 5.45 (74).

Last, I had a great discussion at the VF gun show with a guy about M1's, I guess it was an M1a that could accept the larger mags. I believe this has the accuracy I need out to 200 yards, price....maybe under 1000. Reliability, this I dont know much about except I have never heard bad news about it. I hear it isnt great in full auto but as a semi auto it is supposed to be a great gun.

Its a big dilemma for me. If the AK was accurate I would definitely opt for that. But if you have the drop on a guy and you shoot first and miss, then he will shoot next with his more accurate gun and get you. Plus the AK is super cheap in a basic model.

[aubie515]

Originally Posted by jh664322

From what I have read I wouldnt want to go to war with the thing.

I'd say you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to AR platforms.

Reading forums online doesn't make you an AR expert. I'm sure you have logged hundreds of hours online, which makes you a chairbourne commando in your mind. Owning the weapon platform and using it in battle makes you qualified to make such statements.

Try the FAL if you want a reliable MBR that packs the punch of the .308 and offers you battlefield accuracy. DSA FAL if you can afford it since it's the best FAL offered.

[Jay5oh]

Get a M1A and call it a day.

[TonyF]

You have to try to ground yourself in realities as you decide on which platform to purchase.

I am certainly biased in favor of the stoner platform based on positive experiences in the training environment as both student and staff instructor. I've seen first hand the reasons the stoner platform gets a bad rap and trust me, it isn't the platform, it's people hell bent on trying to "improve" it with allot of aftermarket crap and failing to properly lubricate it. I've also seen quality AR's with good magazines and decent ammo run like sewing machines.

Granted, the training environment in SW PA isn't exactly harsh but where do you expect to find yourself in circumstances whereby you ".... wouldn't have access to a cleaning kit or may have to abuse the hell out of the gun"?

If you could expand on that, and if the concern is well founded, I might be convinced to suggest something other than an AR15. But if it's a matter of fretting and worrying over what you "might" encounter in terms of climate and environmental conditions vs. accuracy vs. lethality, I'm here to tell you that no matter what you choose, skill at arms is what should be your primary focus regardless of the platform.

Fretting over what "might" happen will ultimately drive your anxiety level through the roof because there is no such thing as a "perfect" firearm.

[dgg9]

Originally Posted by jh664322

The ak47 is good on price, reliability, but accuracy doesnt excite me that much.

1. Decide on your mission. A battle rifle does not need super-high accuracy.
2. AK47 accuracy is fine for its intended mission -- you can hit minute-of-torso at 100 - 200 yards all day long.
3. As I always preach: it is a mistake to consider only the cost of the rifle. Are you going to practice and train? Then you have to consider ammo costs.
4. If cost is any factor at all, that mandates the AK. For $1000, you can get an AK47, a sling, 5 magazines and 2.5 cases of 7.62x39 ammo. In short, you'd be set for years. No other battle rifle can deliver the same for your stated cost.

[The_War_Wagon]

SUCCESS with an MBR - as with any firearm - begins with, 'personal comfort.' That is to say, you want one you can handle well, that you feel confident with, the controls are within easy reach, and it does what YOU need it to do! There are a LOT of fine firearms OUT there, but not every one, is right for everybody.

Case in point - the M1A just might be the finest battle rifle ever made for the American GI. Problem is, I've NEVER liked it. Never felt comfortable shooting it, it weighed a ton (with a wooden stock), and I am of the modern school, and my firearms (rifles) require a pistol grip. Yes, they make some exciting new modular, pistol-gripped stocks for the M1A/M14 now, that make it look like a very exciting package, but I have been sufficiently turned off over the years by the design of the weapon, to have no interest in trying another. Besides, I have employed FAL's and G3 clones since then with great success, and am much more comfortable with both (partial to the PTR91 these days, as my avatar indicates - lotta people don't care at ALL for the fire controls on G3 clones, but they suit me fine. Attention to such detail, is best worked out before you break out the checkbook!).

If you have doubts about a rifle, before you ever acquire it, you'll be LOOKING for things to go wrong with it, and bemoan every detail that isn't EXACTLY as you'd like it. So why make yourself miserable, to please someone else? My first HBAR was a dud (PWA - long since gone out of business, & with good reason!!!); I've owned Olympic Arms and DoubleStar CAR15's since then, and enjoyed BOTH! I thought the cartridge and platform had merits, and was not UNcomfortable to work with, so I found manufacturers who made something I liked.

With that said, and with your stated preference for something along an AK platform, why not consider the Bulgarian offerings from Arsenal, Inc. Their Model 107 comes with a synthetic side-folder stock (MUCH better than an underfolder!!!), packs a 7.62x39 punch, and accepts hi-cap mags.

OR... you might want to consider (given the price of ammo), the Model 106, which fires the AK74's 5.45x39 round, which in bulk, is ridiculously cheap these days, when compared to .223 ammo! Both come with heavy-duty milled receivers, and are tops in accuracy for that platform! Both can be had for around $800, FYI.

Regardless your preference at this point, check out a few different rifles in varying platforms, just to make sure you're buying something you'd feel good about staking your life on, come SHTF. There are no 'style points' in the REAL world; if you're getting this as a prep for 'down the road,' make sure you get EXACTLY what you want. There'll be no 'timeouts,' to go back and rethink your decision, or shop for something different, once the flag goes up - you'll HAVE to 'run whut ya' brung!'

Bob

[Mity2]

Originally Posted by aubie515

I'd say you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to AR platforms.

Reading forums online doesn't make you an AR expert. I'm sure you have logged hundreds of hours online, which makes you a chairbourne commando in your mind. Owning the weapon platform and using it in battle makes you qualified to make such statements.

.

So true.
Everyone tells me that you have to clean the hell out of AR for it to work well.
Since i got my AR, Other then initial cleaning, i just wipe bolt down, shot of Rem oil with Teflon, and run brush through the bore. What can I say... i'm lazy

Its been over 2000rds, and i have yet to see any mulfunction.

I'll start cleaning thoughly here soon tho.. inside looking mighty nasty these days...

No matter what people with AK's and those don't have AR would tell you, it is an reliable weapon. It is US's main infantry weapon for almost 40 years now. that ought to mbe worth something...

[DrakinClaw]

all m1 types are grea, however the thing is built like a oversized tank.
unless you are in peak physical health, that think will feel like a 100 tons after a few days on the move with it.
I would suggest going to some CMP events (civilian marksmanship programs), for 15$ you get 80 rounds and a house M1 to try out.
why not just own it all thats the best solution haha

oh and id be carefull knocking any rifle, every rifle has its true pros and cons, and you have some real fans of just about every rifle there is on this board

[Mity2]

I do like M1A, but didn't M1A failed on Guns n, Ammo's tourture test once?
Something like fat guy was crowing through riverbank or something, and gun jammed?

[LorDiego01]

+1 on the FAL.

Google "FAL torture test", and also try to dig up some thread on some forum where a dude shot about 6k of rounds through his FAL without ever cleaning it, plus dropping it in mud and good stuff like that. He has pics of how truly disgusting the thing looks, yet, his gun never failed.

I don't own an AR, and Im not inclined on getting one any time soon, although I've seen some produce amazing accuracy. I hear that the AR was originally designed to work with the 6.5 Grendel round, and thus, produces best results in the caliber. Again, this is just me parroting what I've read on other forums, and I have nothing to back up my AR claims.