Which AR-15 Carbine do you like best?

[27hand]

Only have a 16"Bushy at this point.

I was given an Olympic Arms Lower and was going to put an upper on it for a few years and never got around to it. Midway is selling a complete Stoner upper (parts kit) for $300.

Any input on Stoner? This would probably just be a backup carbine for any classes I may take.

thanks

27hand

[TonyF]

Originally Posted by Cole

Anyone done a serious comparison of AR-15 carbines? I would love to hear some expert opinions comparing the Colt, S&W and other makes out there. For your money, which would you buy for occassional range shooting, extreme home-defense, trips to family farm to shoot varmints and such, etc.

I don't think any of us mere mortals have the capability to conduct an empirical, scientific comparison of the various AR manufacturers so your question is a difficult one to answer.

The best proving ground is the private sector domestic firearms training industry. Most of the top tier instructors, as well as the bigger established schools, probably see hundreds if not thousands of AR15's in classes each year.

The empirical data from those classes puts Colt at the top with regard to reliability. The primary reason is that the .mil / .gov requires quality assurances from Colt that are not performed by any other manufacturers and this is why Colt is generally more expensive. This is not to say you won't occasionally happen upon a Colt that has issues but Colt is the only manufacturer that pressure tests (MP) EVERY bolt and barrel. Bushmaster, S&W, Armalite, DPMS and the others do not. Government quality assurance extends in other ways to most of the other component parts also.

Stag is the commercial retail outlet for Continental Machine and Tool which is a primary subcontractor for Colt so they *may* be MP testing their bolts and barrels for the Stag line but I'm not sure.

I prefer a 1:7 twist barrel in order to stabilize the heavier premium ammo available these days.

The short answer to your question? For my money it's a Colt.

[aubie515]

So you are saying that Colt is the only company to do this...and yet other companies have a military contract with our government. I find it amusing when the Colt fans jump to Colt's defense when Colt is the only company that isn't mil spec'd compared to the rest of the companies. IE Colt requires a different trigger size etc because Colt couldn't have the same specs as RRA or Bushmaster..etc etc. Isn't the whole point of "mil spec" meaning that it's the governments standard...regardless of which company supplied the rifle. To me it makes sense to have every company that has a government contract to have the same specs. I shot the Colt's in basic training and some on active duty....IMO Colt's are over rated. It's your money in the end, so if you are on the band wagon go buy the Colts. As far as QC...at some point there will be a lemon be slips through a production line...it is the cost of doing business.

[TonyF]

Originally Posted by aubie515

So you are saying that Colt is the only company to do this...and yet other companies have a military contract with our government. I find it amusing when the Colt fans jump to Colt's defense when Colt is the only company that isn't mil spec'd compared to the rest of the companies. IE Colt requires a different trigger size etc because Colt couldn't have the same specs as RRA or Bushmaster..etc etc. Isn't the whole point of "mil spec" meaning that it's the governments standard...regardless of which company supplied the rifle. To me it makes sense to have every company that has a government contract to have the same specs. I shot the Colt's in basic training and some on active duty....IMO Colt's are over rated. It's your money in the end, so if you are on the band wagon go buy the Colts. As far as QC...at some point there will be a lemon be slips through a production line...it is the cost of doing business.

aubie,

The only companies that have federal contracts are FN (M16A2), Colt (M4) and RRA (DEA). FN doesn't sell to the commercial market under terms of their contract.

RRA has the DEA contract. I don't know if DEA has the same QA requirements that the .mil does but I'd doubt it. You're fixation on the pin size has absolutely no bearing on the core issues of reliability and functionality and in so doing you're stretching the "mil-spec" issue to fit your particular perspective. FWIW I think it was stupid of Colt to change the pin size but it's a reality that has for better or worse no relevance in the real world for those who go in harms way.

If I wanted to get nit picky with you about RRA I'd ask why they chose to use a non "mil-spec" receiver extension but you know what, that has no bearing in the real world either with folks who stake their lives on these rifles when the chips are down. OTOH, the fact that Bushmaster performs only a cursory and superficial staking of the Carrier Keys on their Bolt Carriers IS a serious issue for someone who carries a rifle for a living. When they work loose (and they WILL), they leak gas and short stroke.

To address your general criticism of Colt I hold the opinion that even if it costs me a bit more for Colt parts I think it's worth it to get Colt's level of reliability. And for the record, Colt's oversized LE - Civilian pins and parts are no more expensive than their "mil-spec" sized counterparts.

[GRIZZLYBEAR]

I have a Bushy with a match grade barrel and a Stoner. I think that I would have go with the Stoner


grizz

[Joe Demko]

I've owned two Colts and two Bushmasters. The only difference, other than pin sizes and the receiver block, was price. None of the four ever gave any problems, all were about equal in accuracy. The Colts costed more, though. So, I confess, during the Assault Weapons Ban, I sold the Colts and kept the Bushmasters. Therefore, if Colt has any advantage, in my experience it lies in resale value.
BTW, this is a PA forum...if that family farm you mentioned for shooting varmints is in Pennsylvania, don't use whichever AR you buy. You'll be in violation of PA Game Commission regulations. If you get caught, you'll be fined for sure and possibly have the AR seized as well. If you want to shoot varmints, get a single shot or some kind of manually operated repeater.

[1927A1]

I've never owned a AR style rifle, but have been looking over the M&P15T.

Price w/ tax and fees around $1,400. I only wish I had a little more info from users, I only want to do this once, without custom add ons to make it work.

Uses home defence, 100 yrd plinking.

[Lougotzz]

Mand P is over priced. Go with RRA for best value. they now have chrome lined barrels in 20 inch. For the money RRA is one of the best values out there

http://www.rockriverarms.com/

[Broomhandle]

I was thinking about getting a cheap lower and spicing it up to be a varmit rifle. Tactical reliability is not an issue. I understand it is not legal for hunting in PA but I can (and would) use it out west to hunt varmints. Plus a fun plinking gun if I can get to a 400m range. A 1:9 chrom-moly 24" floating from Bushmaster seems like a nice choice. Any better options? What about durability?

[Joe Demko]

Well, what about durability? If you can afford enough ammunition to wear out a barrel for the kind of informal shooting you are talking about (worn out is something different when we talk aabout competition guns) then you can afford to replace a barrel and sundry small parts, if necessary.