lr .260h? over lr.308

[Tomcat088]

myfault, I'm just gonna be honest with you, and you can take what you want from this post. I would personally stay away from the .260. First off, just from what I have seen even posted here about the .260 is does NOT have better ballistics than the .308. This is funny for me to say, because most people who have been around know that I'm not the biggest fan of the .308. From some of the data that others have posted and some of what I have seen on Chuck Hawk's website, the .260 is usually starting out at a slower muzzle velocity of the .308, with a bullet that weighs less. http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifle_ballistics_table.htm You can see there where he lists the .260 with a mz of 2750 with a 140 grain bullet. The .308 he lists at 2820 with a 150 grain bullet, and 2620 with a 180 grain bullet. This means that a bullet that weighs 40 grains more, is starting out at only 100 fps slower than the .260's heavier bullets that it shoots. With some of the lighter .260 bullets, you might have better "long range" ballistics, but with some of the heavier bullets, not a chance.

Realize that there are kind of 2 thoughts on wind drift. You can shoot a light bullet faster, which means that it will have a shorter time of flight, and therefore the wind will have less time to affect the bullet. You can also fire a heavier bullet slower, and although it will have a longer time of flight, because it is heavier the wind will not push the bullet as much as a lighter bullet that had the time time of flight. There is also kind of an inbetween ground. Now the .260 with a 140 grain bullet, is still leaving the barrel slower than a 150 grain bullet from the .308, meaning it is lighter and it is moving slower. So it will DEFINATELY not have better long range ballistics.

If you are talking about hunting, a heavier bullet will hold onto kinetic energy out to longer distances. I can assure you that .308 ammunition, especially match grade ammunition will be MUCH easier to find for the .308, than it will be for the .260. I personally think that there are other cartridges that are better than the 6.5 grendel for long range shooting. I would probably take a 7mm-08 over a 6.5 grendel. If you're just looking at .260 vs .308, I'd say go with the .308 all day long and don't EVER look back. If you want to consider some other calibers, I'd be more than happy to talk about them. If thinking about the .260 vs the .308, I say the .260 is more of a fad, and a fun new cartridge to play with and say that you have and nobody else does. Go with the .308 if these are the main two options.

P.S. If you really were thinking about the 6.5 Grendel, I'd say go with a .243 over it. I'd take a .243 AI over the 6.5 grendel any day of the week. The .243 fires the same weight (sometimes) heavier bullets faster than the 6.5 grendel. With some of the heavier bullets, the Grendel might have a slight edge, but not much. You could still beat the 6.5 Grendel with the 7mm-08, and it would be just as easy to get ammunition for. .243 ammuntion is also MUCH easier to get the 6.5 Grendel. It's your choice, if it'll help you, I'll even post up some of the numbers so you can see it for yourself, and you can also do some research on it. Sure it's fun to say that you have some toy that everybody wants to hear about, but if it doesn't shoot really any better and costs you more to shoot, why buy it? You might see some loadings of the 6.5 grendel (handloads) that are going to be hotter than the factory loadings that might influence you. Just realize that if you compare apples to apples and compared some of the hot .243 loads, they're gonna put the statistics pretty close to where they were with factory loadings.

[Lycanthrope]

What Tomcat said.

Plus.....

I'm a big fan of the 6mm loads in the short actions for accurate and cheaper shooting.

If you want hard core, then you're looking at the .300 win mag or other hot calibers.


Lycan6mmBRisniceforreloadersthrope

[myfault]

figures as soon as you guys get me ready for the .308 someone on arfcom shows me this

http://demigodllc.com/articles/the-c...260-remington/



"The .260 Remington blows .308 out of the water. It has 35% less wind drift and about 10 MOA less drop at 1000 yards than the standard 175-grain M118LR load. Despite a 35-grain deficiency in bullet mass, it has 31% more energy because it loses less along the way due to atmospheric drag, hitting 350 fps faster at 1000 yards."

[aubie515]

Another consideration is that if you want the DPMS you can have both 260 and 308 in the same platform. If you want the 260 and Grendel, you will need to purchase two rifles. The 260 will not support the Grendel cartridge and vice versa.

I've owned two DPMS LR 308 Panthers and they are bad a$$. That being said, if you are just thinking about getting into reloading...I'd go with common calibers to start off with the reloading hobby. Brass and bullets for 30cal will be easier to find and cheaper compared to the 260 and Grendel. You can pick up 308 range brass to supply your reloading.

Bill at Alexander Arms is a PITA to deal with...which is why he has such tight controls over his Grendel round. I have wanted a Grendel since it was introduced, but I held off because of the owner. I would choose the Grendel over the 6.8SPC any day of the week. Based on the available bullet weights of the bullets. The Grendel can be loaded wight light loads to heavy loads. The 6.8 does not have a lot of variety in bullet weights.

If you plan on shooting a lot, go with a common caliber. Factory ammo has gone through the roof and so have reloading componets. Think smart and buy once...make foolish decisions and you will cry to every forum you belong to...Nuff said.

[myfault]

lol yea thats good advice man

[Konsukah_19]

260 being a bad round? Wow, first time I have ever heard of that. Know a guy who shoots out to 1000 regualrly in a tweaked DPMS and it does better bucking the wind then his 308. Bear in mind he is using Lapua Scenars. I personally like the 308 because it is a common round, and it is not too hard to reload with. Bullet choices are vast and you can load anything from 110 FN to 190 SMK. I am gonna say, the 308 aint the best long range caliber, but, it certainly aint the worst. I prefer the 30-06 if I have to go beyond 650 yards with some choppy winds. 308 will do it, but the 30-06 will do it a little better.

In terms of the 6.5 Grendel, I have heard favorable things, even had the chance to shoot one. Recoil is soft, and I hear that the ballistic coefficients are very impressive. Only downside is (hell, if you even want to call it a downside) is that you will have to realod the caliber as there are no comercial rounds available for it. I do know Wolf is planning to do some loads. 123 grain Lapua scenar launched from that rifle I hear is the cats nuts out to 1000 yards.

I would also not discount the 7mm/08. Another great round. Flat shooting, not much recoil, more vast bullets available, etc. Only thing is, you would have to have a custom barrel made for the AR as this is not a caliber DPMS is offeringAnd in my opinion, go with a shorter barrel. I know people knockin em dead way out there with 20 inch tubes.

[sluggie24]

Originally Posted by myfault

figures as soon as you guys get me ready for the .308 someone on arfcom shows me this

http://demigodllc.com/articles/the-c...260-remington/



"The .260 Remington blows .308 out of the water. It has 35% less wind drift and about 10 MOA less drop at 1000 yards than the standard 175-grain M118LR load. Despite a 35-grain deficiency in bullet mass, it has 31% more energy because it loses less along the way due to atmospheric drag, hitting 350 fps faster at 1000 yards."

Alot of the changes you are talking about can be compensated for with a good scope and an accurate ballistics program on your load. If you are simply looking for a round with the smallest amount of compensation needed at longer ranges then say hello to the .338LM!

[Tomcat088]

Originally Posted by myfault

figures as soon as you guys get me ready for the .308 someone on arfcom shows me this

http://demigodllc.com/articles/the-c...260-remington/

"The .260 Remington blows .308 out of the water. It has 35% less wind drift and about 10 MOA less drop at 1000 yards than the standard 175-grain M118LR load. Despite a 35-grain deficiency in bullet mass, it has 31% more energy because it loses less along the way due to atmospheric drag, hitting 350 fps faster at 1000 yards."

Howdy myfault. The article that you list has some truth to it, and it also has ALOT of BS that is just touting the horn of the .260. I can tell you for a fact that there is NOW WAY IN HELL that the .260 will outperform the .300 winmag at long range. What I think is funny is that they compare the 140 grain bullet from the .260 at 2840 fps to the 190 grain bullet out of a .300 winmag at 2900 fps. This means that they will probably have close to the same time of flight, because the .300 winmag bullet starts out faster, but according to them, losing velocity faster because of the aerodynamics of the 6.5mm bullet. Even if this is true, if they have close to the same time of flight, then the .300 winmag will have LESS wind drift because it still weighs significantly more; at the very least it would have about the same. The other thing is that I have seen LOTS of .300 winmag loadings that push 190 grain bullets around the 3000-3100 fps mark, especially out of a 26" barrel. They say that it pushes those 140 grain bullets at 2840 from a 26" barrel, I'm guessing they probably used a 24" barrel on the .300 winmag, you give it a 26" or 28" barrel and it'll be smoking that .260. There are also extremely high BC bullets for the .30's that I'm sure they did not use in this comparison. If you used a Lost River Ballistics bullet (who got bought out by hooker I believe), those high BC bullets would put the .260 to shame. If I'm not mistaken, I believe that lost river ballistics had a 180 grain bullet that had a BC of .9 or something ridiculous like that.

Please keep in mind that I'm not saying that the .260 is a bad cartridge, I'm just saying that some of what is in that article is hype. I'm also saying that especially if you don't reload, there are much more feasible calibers for you to choose from that would probably fit you better. Have you ever shot out to 1K? If you haven't and most of your shooting is going to be at 500 or around that area, you're probably not even going to notice most of the difference. That article does have some truth to it though, that the .300 winmag 7mm mag, etc will have more recoil and burn through barrels faster. That's the price you have to pay if you want the advantage in firing heavier bullets near the 3,000 fps mark.

[myfault]

ok well i think you guys have convinced me. Im going to go with the lr.308 24 inch and upgrading to an a3 upper

[Tomcat088]

I think that is probably a good decision myfault, and I'm sure that you will not be disapopinted with the .308. I too am a fan of some of the longer barrels, so that you have a little more room to work with building up a little extra velocity and have more choices with powders. Best of luck to you and see you around.