ATF "White Paper" on firearms regulations (not what you may think)

Understand. But bullets fly in cities like Chicago. Not all of them have a known origin. All that is needed is for people telling media they never heard a shot and some newshawk suggesting a silencer was used, and off we go. Remember cop-killer (Black Talons), Saturday Night Specials, and other buzz-words from the past? All I'm saying is we are all subject to bullshit that certain politicians cash in on. A "silencer" to the unknowing public is the tool of the professional hit man.

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Originally Posted by Bang

Understand. But bullets fly in cities like Chicago. Not all of them have a known origin. All that is needed is for people telling media they never heard a shot and some newshawk suggesting a silencer was used, and off we go. Remember cop-killer (Black Talons), Saturday Night Specials, and other buzz-words from the past? All I'm saying is we are all subject to bullshit that certain politicians cash in on. A "silencer" to the unknowing public is the tool of the professional hit man.

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But that is the problem not the supressors. I am not quite getting the tome of your post. Are you suggesting we should not have supressors or that if we do get them deregulated it would be short lived?

Let me go back and re-read what I posted. Hang on...

A couple of assassinations by subsonic .22 rifle will make short shrift of free-marketed suppressors. Too many snowflakes have been produced to stand up to not punishing the many for what is done by the few. Hope I'm wrong...but history is what I am looking at.

Yep...could be short lived. Short is relative. The antis will chip away for how many years, as they are doing now.

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Originally Posted by Bang

Let me go back and re-read what I posted. Hang on...

A couple of assassinations by subsonic .22 rifle will make short shrift of free-marketed suppressors. Too many snowflakes have been produced to stand up to not punishing the many for what is done by the few. Hope I'm wrong...but history is what I am looking at.

Yep...could be short lived. Short is relative. The antis will chip away for how many years, as they are doing now.

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My mistake. You were clear from the beginning.

If ATF makes any of these changes as a regulatory agency then the hearing protection act in congress will run out of steam pretty quickly.

Then WHEN an anti gun administration gets in again they can easily just change it back. And leave all of those who bought deregulated items in the interim in the lurch.

It would be much more difficult for them to reverse a law than to make another regulatory change.

i would also not discount the comments about the ATF trying not to get eliminated, and this guy hoping to get a promotion from an at least nominally pro gun administration.

I need a video clip of Ash from army of Darkness saying "It's a trick. Get an Axe."

A White Paper isn't just one guy's opinion. It is a statement prepared with a great amount of forethought that lays out what the senior leadership (i,e bureaucrats administering) ATFE think needs to be done.

Truecrimson pointed out that changing regulations instead of changing the law is both easier to do and easier to undo is probably right on the money. However Congress and the President have batted this ball for decades and the result is the current mess. However the good news is that ATFE seems to want to loosen many of the excessive and contradictory rules which only serve to entrap the unwary with technical violations. Given the current administration I think we just may get surpressors taken off the NFA list. That would be a very positive step towards more sanity on regulations.

Sadly I didn't see the Hughes amendment going away. I should have bought a full auto back in the 90s when prices were only stupid and before they became insane.

One thing we do have to be thankful for is ATFE has made a great deal of effort to not screw people over by retroactively changing rules and then prosecute people for it (which is so common in other places outside of USA...well Kalifornia excepted). Of course some may find my take to be outside of their reality.

I'll go back to my morning coffee now... :)

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Originally Posted by Ecclectic Collector

A White Paper isn't just one guy's opinion. It is a statement prepared with a great amount of forethought that lays out what the senior leadership (i,e bureaucrats administering) ATFE think needs to be done.

Truecrimson pointed out that changing regulations instead of changing the law is both easier to do and easier to undo is probably right on the money. However Congress and the President have batted this ball for decades and the result is the current mess. However the good news is that ATFE seems to want to loosen many of the excessive and contradictory rules which only serve to entrap the unwary with technical violations. Given the current administration I think we just may get surpressors taken off the NFA list. That would be a very positive step towards more sanity on regulations.

Sadly I didn't see the Hughes amendment going away. I should have bought a full auto back in the 90s when prices were only stupid and before they became insane.

One thing we do have to be thankful for is ATFE has made a great deal of effort to not screw people over by retroactively changing rules and then prosecute people for it (which is so common in other places outside of USA...well Kalifornia excepted). Of course some may find my take to be outside of their reality.

I'll go back to my morning coffee now... :)

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I hope your last statement is tongue in cheek. If it is not you are sadly misinformed about the Aholes that are the ATFE.

Bobgun,

I can't and won't try to defend the indefensible. Every agent who wears a badge is subject to the disease of going on ego trips and using their duty as a catch all for behaving in an unprofessional and aggressive manner. I don't feel I need to go on an anti-government tirade about ATFE every time they are discussed.

My point is about how firearms regulations are made. You want to see trampling of rights, go look at how people who want to own and use firearms are treated in many other countries. Compared to those examples, our regulations are much more flexible and tolerant on the side of the everyday person.

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Originally Posted by Ecclectic Collector

Bobgun,

I can't and won't try to defend the indefensible. Every agent who wears a badge is subject to the disease of going on ego trips and using their duty as a catch all for behaving in an unprofessional and aggressive manner. I don't feel I need to go on an anti-government tirade about ATFE every time they are discussed.

My point is about how firearms regulations are made. You want to see trampling of rights, go look at how people who want to own and use firearms are treated in many other countries. Compared to those examples, our regulations are much more flexible and tolerant on the side of the everyday person.

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I disagree with you. Any restriction is a complete breach of our rights. There is no need to compare with other places an infringement is an infringement. You can't dig half of a hole.

Mpan,

Thank you for being polite even though we disagree on this issue.