Poor Experience at Ace

[Kyle H]

Sad to have to make this thread as my previous experiences with them have been great but today really just kind of killed it.

I have been searching for an H&K USC for a while now and noticed that Ace had one on their "used guns" list so I called this morning to make sure they still had it before I left. I thought for sure I would be riding home with it so I went ahead and got the funds together for the purchase as well as getting my Kimber to see if it was worth anything on trade.

I got down there around 1 or so and decided to look around for the gun for myself since the salesmen all seemed to be pretty busy, no big deal. After looking all around for this black USC all I found was a new one for $1669 and a grey used one. I got a salesman's attention and asked him to show me both.

Heres the direct quote from the Ace website:

H&K USC CARBINE 45ACP 16 BL RSEMI MINT ORIG BOX XTRA MAGS BL $1,495.00

As you can see the description on their website clearly states its black in color and in mint condition. The gun was neither. Thee grey rifle was in good condition, I will give them that, but there were clearly signs that it had been used ie powder burns around the ejection port, scuffs on the barrel. I asked the sales man a couple questions like how long they had had it, if anything else came with it, etc... He pretty much treated me like I was a 14 year old kid at a car dealership. His response to my question about how long they had it was "Oh I'm not sure" and to my question of what else came with it he said "It says here original box". I understand you cant know everything about every used gun you sell but the guy put in ZERO effort into answering my questions fully. I have no desire for the grey USC's as they are slightly outdated and pre-'07 manufacture and especially not for $1500 in the condition it was in so I turned towards the new one.

I knew the price was a little high for the market on these as I pretty much watch GB and the H&K forums religiously for them but I thought we might be able to compromise. The first thing I notice, the cocking lever is cracked. I dont know if he didn't hear my question fully or was ignoring it but when I asked him about it he said "Oh I dont know". Once again really not putting in any effort to close the sale.

I wasn't fully going to give up on Ace yet so I showed him the Kimber and asked him what they might give me in trade towards the USC, a rifle I know they dont have a high demand, or any demand even, for. He comes back with an offer that I thought was pretty low considering they had a new one in the case for nearly $1400, and says thats cash. They wouldnt offer me any more whether I used it towards another gun they had or not. Now maybe I'm alone in thinking this but if a customer clearly wants to keep their cash there in the business dont you think you'd be willing to bump up your offer? Especially if he knew I might take that used USC off their hands, a gun I'm sure they bought on a low-ball offer.

So anyways, I left empty handed and disappointed. I know Ace gets rave reviews and the few times I've dont business there they provided me with good service but I'm pretty sure todays situation ruined any posibility of me going back.

[KJP442]

Not the first time I've heard of them giving really low ball offers on good pieces. Ace has a nice showroom but the prices generally turn me off.

[Python73]

Have to say I haven't had good experiences at Ace either, as far as getting help goes. You can't just look like you need assistance there, or be standing where it seems someone should help you. You need to sack up and wade in to get someone. "YOU THERE! HOW ABOUT YOU HELP ME?" It isn't that they aren't helpful after you get them. Just that thinking you'll politely wait for them to notice you and offer help is fail.

That's sad, because as far as selection goes they are really a step above. But browsing there is painfully difficult. I suspect there are good hours to go when the place isn't so busy that you can get face time with the right guys that would make the shop more enjoyable.

As for making an offer on your gun, you need to expect a store/dealer/etc to make terrible offers. They are factoring in what they can get a new one for, how long they think they will need to sell it, demand in their particular store, etc. The markup they have to put on your item has to come out of your end of the deal. And very few places will ever admit that they can give a bit more in trade because of the markup on their items. It is sort of a hands off topic for retailers. They'd rather you not make a trade than have to deal with you expecting to work in that profit zone. That's my opinion based on 10 years working in a hobby/retail store combined with my experiences trying to sell or trade my own used guns.

[renegadephoenix]

Kyle, ask for CHRIS SMITH next time your in.

my work Schedule at Ace is Tuesday through Friday, 11-9, Saturday 9-5 and Sunday 11-4



the quote of Ace's Description mentions no where about it being a black gun, the "16"BL" if the barrel only, not the color of the gun, we only have so much room for description.

as python said, we have to take into account of what we buy/sell a new one at the condition of the gun, how long we think it will take to sell that gun and our markup. you are always better off selling it outright to a private party if you want a higher price.

you had the Ultra Covert II correct? New price is $1349.88, from what i saw of the condition, yours was Excelent to Excelent Plus, all your extra mags don't do much to any deal as new mags aren't that expensive. we would have had to sell that gun for around $900.00 max. i don't know what they offered you, so i can;t comment on what the Buyer saw, just from my own experiance.

[Kyle H]

Originally Posted by Python73

Have to say I haven't had good experiences at Ace either, as far as getting help goes. You can't just look like you need assistance there, or be standing where it seems someone should help you. You need to sack up and wade in to get someone. "YOU THERE! HOW ABOUT YOU HELP ME?" It isn't that they aren't helpful after you get them. Just that thinking you'll politely wait for them to notice you and offer help is fail.

That's sad, because as far as selection goes they are really a step above. But browsing there is painfully difficult. I suspect there are good hours to go when the place isn't so busy that you can get face time with the right guys that would make the shop more enjoyable.

As for making an offer on your gun, you need to expect a store/dealer/etc to make terrible offers. They are factoring in what they can get a new one for, how long they think they will need to sell it, demand in their particular store, etc. The markup they have to put on your item has to come out of your end of the deal. And very few places will ever admit that they can give a bit more in trade because of the markup on their items. It is sort of a hands off topic for retailers. They'd rather you not make a trade than have to deal with you expecting to work in that profit zone. That's my opinion based on 10 years working in a hobby/retail store combined with my experiences trying to sell or trade my own used guns.

Heres how I look at the situation.

They have this USC, Im guessing they paid maybe $1000 for it. I was offering them my gun plus $300 (sales tax and such NOT included). If they put my gun out there for $1100 then settled on selling it for $1000 they would be up $300. $100 less profit as them sitting on this USC at $1500 and probably settling for $1400. And lets be real, my Kimber is going to go way faster than a USC. Those guns just have zero demand by 99% of the gun owning population.

But like I said, thats just how I reasoned it in my head and its based on a lot of ASSumptions.

[BDK]

Originally Posted by Python73

As for making an offer on your gun, you need to expect a store/dealer/etc to make terrible offers. They are factoring in what they can get a new one for, how long they think they will need to sell it, demand in their particular store, etc. The markup they have to put on your item has to come out of your end of the deal. And very few places will ever admit that they can give a bit more in trade because of the markup on their items. It is sort of a hands off topic for retailers. They'd rather you not make a trade than have to deal with you expecting to work in that profit zone. That's my opinion based on 10 years working in a hobby/retail store combined with my experiences trying to sell or trade my own used guns.

Now that is a truth that needs stickied and posted on every forum where someone says they were lowballed on a used anything.

Does make me curious how many times I've seen Python and just never realized it in the Cranberry hobby shops.

But to stick up for Kyle a bit on the description, I was on ACE's used list this morning and I took that BL at the end before price to mean a gun was black.

[Kyle H]

Originally Posted by renegadephoenix

Kyle, I worked yesterday. i know who you dealt with. it was not me. next time come see me First. if it's busy and i'm with a customer, let me know your there, and just hang tight till i finish with that customer. this goes for anyone who has had bad experiances. Come See Me First!! ask for CHRIS SMITH

my work Schedule at Ace is Tuesday through Friday, 11-9, Saturday 9-5 and Sunday 11-4



the quote of Ace's Description mentions no where about it being a black gun, the "16"BL" if the barrel only, not the color of the gun, we only have so much room for description.

as python said, we have to take into account of what we buy/sell a new one at the condition of the gun, how long we think it will take to sell that gun and our markup. you are always better off selling it outright to a private party if you want a higher price.

you had the Ultra Covert II correct? New price is $1349.88, from what i saw of the condition, yours was Excelent to Excelent Plus, all your extra mags don't do much to any deal as new mags aren't that expensive. we would have had to sell that gun for around $900.00 max. i don't know what they offered you, so i can;t comment on what the Buyer saw, just from my own experiance.

Chris,

I actually looked around the forums in search of your name because I saw you post about working there but I couldnt find it and there was no way I was going to ask someone who "renegadephoenix" was haha.

As far as the description, logic clearly leads you to believe its black. As you can see the third title is labeled "Finish" and in the screen shoot of the USC the "Finish" column clearly says BL. I now know that BL stands for blued but the USC doesnt come in blued, its Grey or Black. The very first listing for the GSG even says Gry in the Finish description.




As far as coming back to deal with you, maybe my next go around. I'm not super heated about anything that went down but I def. dont feel like the Ace went above and beyond to earn my business and to make me feel justified in spending the extra money with you guys compared to what I can buy online. I would LOVE to spend my money at some place local but I'm not going to just throw it at a company that doesnt treat me like they want my business.

Once again, I wasn't so much disappointed in the offer as much as the fact that I figured Ace would be more willing to work with me due to the item I was interested in.

I appreciate you standing up for your company and trying to make things right, you seem like you've got your head on straight and know a thing or two about making customers happy.

[gnbrotz]

Chris is definitely a stand-up guy, but when one goes to any place of business, they shouldn't have to hope they get lucky and encounter "the good employee".

[Connal]

I have to say, after selling cars for several years, the one big problem I see here is guessing at prices.

They might have given some schmuck $20 for it, they might have no room to move at all if someone was a hard haggler, and wanted something that sat there long enough.

What it comes down to is that they made you an offer. You like it, or you don't. If you like it, great. If not, counter offer, or find a different one.

This is the way that businesses operate. I myself have gotten a little miffed when I was offered less than I thought something was worth. And in the same respect, when someone wouldn't move on a price as much as I thought they could/should.

Personally, what I would do. Go back, work with Chris. I trust him to give me a good deal. I just don't have the time to make the two and a half hour trip. He might be able to do a good deal, he might not. You never know until you try.

[M&P Chris]

I always have good experiences with Chris as well as the other employees. I usually go in on weekdays during the morning hours and get waited on right away. As far as an offer on a trade: A store knows what it is going to sell your gun for. The money on their part is the BUY which is expected some due to them being a business. Also if a shop has 3 used of the same gun, why accept another?