Your Valued Opinions On The Glock 21

[G21.45]

Ahhh, ...... this, 'old saw' again!

You picked the right caliber for shooting lead bullets – 45 acp! More than the cold-forged polygonal rifling, it's that very sharp shoulder on Glock chambers that can quickly cause lead to build up in front of the chamber's leade area.

I've been on Glock Talk for 6 years, now; I KNOW for a fact that a lot of reloaders are using home cast lead bullets in their Glock pistols and would disagree with the majority opinion that Glocks can’t handle or shoot lead. In fact, IT’S THE OPERATOR who can’t shoot lead in a Glock pistol.

Whatever barrel you use, take the time to polish the chamber before you start shooting lead; (You can use something as simple as a Q-Tip and Flitz Polish.) and, 'season' the barrel with 2 or 3 hundred rounds of FMJ before you make the switch.

If you have a decent source for lead bullets that are (1) properly sized to no more than .001" over your particular bore diameter, (2) are properly lubricated, and (3) fairly hard, (Hard enough that you can't dent the lead with a fingernail or toothpick) then, you CAN shoot those lead bullets in your Glock pistol.

You need to check and see how much leading you get with whatever lead bullet you're presently using in your particular barrel. Generally, if the lead has a BHN of between 14 and 18, you should be fine. (Talk to your supplier; or, maybe, look in the mirror!) There are, also, high tech barrel coatings like Sentry Solutions, 'Smooth Kote' you can apply to the bore, beforehand, in order to keep the leading down and facilitate brush out.

Remember to keep your powder charges moderate, and the bullet's hardness within the Brinell scale described above. Don't get sloppy and over-lube the bullets, and keep your sized bullets at no more than .001" over bore diameter.

Many shooters, myself included, do use conventionally-rifled (aftermarket) barrels in order to shoot lead in a Glock. However, generally speaking, if you take these described precautions then you should be fine with a standard Glock factory barrel. Use a conventional phosphor-bronze brush for cleaning, too. A fast brushing every 50 rounds, or so, with something like, 'Kroil' or, 'Hoppe’s #9' followed by several cotton patches wrapped around the brush head can tell you a lot about what's going on in a particular barrel.

Often it's the + .002", or larger, bullets that are either too soft, or too heavily lubed that cause leading problems. Because manufacturing tolerances differ, you may have to experiment with different bullets before you find an ideal match for your pistol.

Polygonal rifling generally seals tighter than conventional button-swagged land & groove rifling. With all other conditions the same, this is sure to create slightly higher lead bullet pressures - So be aware of what you're doing! Because of the unique design characteristics of polygonal rifling, it will foul to some greater extent than conventional broach-cut rifling. If a cold-forged polygonal barrel fouls enough, it might constrict the bullet as it passes through the bore - Thus creating a much higher chamber pressure and, perhaps, one of those infamous Glock kB!s.

How many rounds are fired in order to reach that critical amount of lead fouling depends upon: (1) the bullet’s muzzle velocity, (2) the bullet’s actual design, (3) the hardness of the lead, (4) the overall diameter of the lead bullet used, and (5) how often the barrel is cleaned.

Perhaps the most certain way to keep barrel leading down is to, first, keep the bullet’s velocity down. At or below 900 fps is a good general rule to follow. A big culprit in lead buildup is hot gas erosion of the bullet’s base that occurs during firing. There are two principal ways to limit the amount of base erosion that might occur: One is to properly lubricate the lead bullets; Filling the lube ring with a heavy lubricant like Alox is a preferred method.

If you intend to raise bullet velocity beyond the 900 fps ceiling then Alox treatment, alone, may not be enough. With a substantial powder charge an additional copper or aluminum gas check swaged into the bullet’s base may, also, be needed in order to keep base erosion down and reduce the amount of lead buildup in the barrel.

A lot of reloaders believe that the harder a lead bullet is, then, the less it will lead; but, this isn’t necessarily true. Factors other than hardness impact strongly on the amount of barrel leading that can occur. I’ve used both very hard and very soft lead bullets. It’s been my experience that when you’re doing everything else right, the bullets, themselves, only need to be within a specific range of hardness which - in most semiautomatic pistols - generally falls between 12 and 22 BHN. (Brinell Hardness Number)

This means that most, if not all, commercially availably lead bullets are going to be too soft. The reason for this is that commercially produced lead bullets are invariably swaged from large rolls of soft lead wire. Want to lead up your Glock real fast? Then buy commercially produced lead bullets!

I’ve read where reloaders are using lead bullets with diameters oversized by as much as .003”. Personally, I wouldn’t go over .001” in ANY polygonal barrel from ANY pistol manufacturer. (Yes, I have no doubt that in the universe of Glock pistols that's out there, somewhere, there must be a 1st or 2nd generation Glock pistol that would benefit from either .002” or even .003” oversized lead bullets.)

The leade area at the front of Glock chambers is very short; and, this is the first place I’d look for lead to start building up. Get lead here, and the pressure is sure to increase. I made the switch to Berry Manufacturing’s plated lead bullets awhile ago; and, I’m no longer shooting non-plated lead bullets in my Glocks; however, because you never really know what may or may not be available at any given time, I do think it’s important to know how to properly load lead bullets for anyone’s polygonal pistol barrel. (By the way, plated bullets can behave very much like lead; so, be aware!)

While you’re learning how your particular polygonal rifled pistol and your particular lead bullets perform together, it’s not just a good idea, it’s actually necessary to stop shooting every magazine, or so, and carefully examine, wet scrub, and wire brush out the bore. (Pay particular attention to the chamber’s leade area; and, look to see if any leading that occurs closely follows the high lines in the bore because this is a sure sign of hot gas bypass and base erosion.)

After you shoot lead bullets in your Glock for awhile you’ll know how often to stop, examine, and brush out your polygonal rifled pistol barrel for the particular lead bullet and powder charge combination that you are using.

HERE’S some of the best information about shooting lead bullets I’ve, yet, found on the internet.

[Dave_n]

Could not agree more with the poster above. I use 200 grain clad SWC @0.451 or 230 grain FMJs @0.452. I will not give loads, but if you look in Lee's handbook, any powder that gives around 800-825 fps will do. Remember, if your friend uses Win 231 (which I do not), then you cannot easily reduce the load. Dave_n

[Conglomeration Al]

Wow. Thanks for the info. I should have prefaced my prior post with: "I know nothing about handloading." I've just heard somethings about it being more accurate and I shot some handloads out of a Wilson once and it was the most accurate i've ever shot.

One more question though. Would FMJ loads be just as accurate as lead loads? Is there som pressing reason as to why lead bullets are used over FMJ?

Thanks again for the informative post!

[24/7dude]

G21 is too big and bulky, go for a 17, 19, 22, or 23

[DaveM55]

I carry a G21SF as my duty gun and absolutely love it. This coming from a former SIGsnob and still SIGaholic.

I've had the G21SF close to two years and have been through a couple training classes with it. Never had any failures, other than those intentionally induced as part of the class. Very accurate and reliable.

Plus it's only got 33 parts. Disassembly, maintenance, repair and cleaning are so easy a caveman could do it.

It's no fine work of craftsmanship and if you ask me, Glocks are butt freak'n ugly, but IMHO as far as a great tool designed to do a particular function you just can't beat it.

For looks I still love the SIG P229, but I sold mine. Bought a G33 in .357SIG

[bripro]

Lets just say that my 45 ACPs are G21, H&K USP Tactical, Kimber Eclipse, Taurus 1911, S&W 325PD and Beretta CX4 Storm. They are all locked up tight in the safe.......except for the Glock 21.

[DBZ220]

I'm pretty much a SIG guy but I've owned many Glocks over the years. I've had a couple G21's and put thousands of rounds through them. Only thing I never liked was the overall thickness of the pistol. I normally carry IWB in the summer and the thing just wasn't comfortable over long periods for me. Both my G21's were very accurate and functioned 100% with anything I fed them. I normally carry a Sig P220 but I often miss the G21 for its capacity and almost maintenance free nature.