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  #41 (permalink)  
Old August 14th, 2010, 09:06 PM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

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Originally Posted by thanker92 View Post
Sorry to yank your chain but I try to inject "humor" where I can.
There are a lot of variables in "knockdown" power and a lot of people have tried to quantify it over the years.
I knew what ya meant. I was getting at the fact that speed, energy, color, and whether or not your box says "tactical body slaying bullets with nuclear tips" doesnt matter... How the thing reacts with the target does. The reaction to impact is not as dependent on "energy" as people want to think. Energy is useless as a variable.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old August 14th, 2010, 10:15 PM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

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Originally Posted by PA Traveler View Post
Do I like my 9mm? Yes. But if I were going to carry a wheelgun (and my wife probably will) I would not feel undergunned with .38 +P s.

Bottom line - carry the largest caliber you can shoot effectively, in a delivery system that meets your needs for accessibility and/or concealment.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This.

9mm and .38 are almost always my carry guns. That being said I do not feel under-gunned with a 5 shot revolver. It took me a little while to come to this conclusion, mostly because it takes practice to be profecient with the snubbie. Not saying you don't have to practice with a 9mm handgun, only that accuracy and speed come much easier with a full sized gun with good sights and a long(ish) barrel. A small revolver strips away all these advantages and makes you practice fundamentals.

I can't (and don't want to) always carry a full size pistol. 16+1 is very comforting, don't get me wrong, but sometimes comfort (physical) and concealment are important too. This is why I carry .38.

I'll tell you one thing, I was shooting rows of water filled milk jugs last week and the .38 special +P rounds I'm carrying make a mess. I sure as hell wouldn't want to be on the wrong end of one, even if 9mm is a better round.

That's another question... Maybe I'll make a new thread; Light and fast .38 hollow points, or 158 gr LSWCHP?
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old August 14th, 2010, 10:19 PM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

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Originally Posted by orionz06 View Post
The reaction to impact is not as dependent on "energy" as people want to think. Energy is useless as a variable.
In other words: You won't be able to tell any appreciable difference if you get hit by a truck going 50mph or one going 70mph.
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Old August 15th, 2010, 03:18 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

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Originally Posted by bripro View Post
Im not into ballistic comparisons so Ill just ask you experts. Is a good 38+P hollow point as effective/more effective than 9 mm HPs for a defensive round?
without all the off topic Bullshit

a .38 +P is perfectly acceptable for a defensive situation
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old August 15th, 2010, 06:08 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

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Originally Posted by IronButt View Post
In other words: You won't be able to tell any appreciable difference if you get hit by a truck going 50mph or one going 70mph.
The truck example doesnt work. Comparing two different JHP's that will expand differently is the issue, not how fast they are going. That is why most people measure the end result, penetration and reliable expansion.
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  #46 (permalink)  
Old August 15th, 2010, 07:15 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

Here are the ballistics for a 124 gr Gold dot 9mm:

Velocity Energy
Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards
1150 1039 963 364 297 255

125 gr Gold Dot .38 +P:

Velocity Energy
Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards
945 891 845 248 220 198


Looks pretty close to me.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old August 15th, 2010, 09:11 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

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Originally Posted by orionz06 View Post
The truck example doesnt work. Comparing two different JHP's that will expand differently is the issue, not how fast they are going. That is why most people measure the end result, penetration and reliable expansion.
No, what I was getting at is, if it knocks you on your ass & you don't get up, that's all that's necessary.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old August 15th, 2010, 09:53 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

digging past all of all the e-penis waving, I would like to chime in that the .38+P is a great defensive round, but has 2 drawbacks.

1. The delivery system generally has more muzzle flip and felt recoil (revolver).
2. Weapon capacity is generally much smaller (revolver).

IMHO, carry what you can afford to practice with, what you can feel comfortable carrying (some guys don't like the weight of a full 1911 and opt for a Commander) and get training when you can.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old August 15th, 2010, 10:12 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronButt View Post
No, what I was getting at is, if it knocks you on your ass & you don't get up, that's all that's necessary.
You are not knocked on your ass by the impact of the bullet, you fall on your ass because of the pain felt, but not all, or even most of the BGs fall down immediately cause of the way aggressive personalities feel pain, the body tends to shut down the pain receptors when they are stimulated too much.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaS_2l8nGdg

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoder View Post
Here are the ballistics for a 124 gr Gold dot 9mm:

Velocity Energy
Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards
1150 1039 963 364 297 255

125 gr Gold Dot .38 +P:

Velocity Energy
Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards Muzzle 50 yards 100 yards
945 891 845 248 220 198


Looks pretty close to me.
Not really, Well at further distances yeah, but at the ranges you will be engaging someone in defense of yourself not close at all. But energy imparted and velocity are not nearly as important as folk make it out to be. Bullet diameter of the .38 9.1mm. Now a bullet designed for use in .38 +p could expand to the same as if not greater diameter as a different one in 9mm, and penetrate to the same depth.
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Last edited by Former_Marine99; August 15th, 2010 at 10:19 AM.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old August 15th, 2010, 10:22 AM
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Default Re: Is 38 +P as good a defensive round as 9mil?

All things being equal........the 9mm does have an edge on the .38+p round but, there are good loads with the .38 that come close,its a very accurate round and if you want to use a revolver its a better choice then the 9mm.
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