AR-15 OWNERS – take note of immanent PSP regulations changes

[mojo]

So does that mean you can go from Rifle to Pistol to Rifle and back as many times as you want with your AR? Wouldn't that conflict with the whole "AR pistols have to be built from lowers that never had a stock attached"? If they are doing transfers as pistols, then they are pistols. Could I buy an LMT 10.5 AR with a stock now without a SBR stamp since they will be treating them as pistols?

[Robert Kayland]

Does this mean all current privately-owned AR lowers are grandfathered and don't need to be in PICS... or do they now expect us to run down to an FFL and get official paperwork done on each one we own, lest the PSP or other LEO will then confiscate them in the future if/when they stop somebody at a range or search a home or some such thing?

/Shoot! And it wasn't like anyone was OC'ing them or anything.

[renegadephoenix]

Originally Posted by Robert Kayland

SNIP

/Shoot! And it wasn't like anyone was OC'ing them or anything.

here you go:

[ChamberedRound]

Originally Posted by Emptymag

Have you been paying attention?

This has been "enforced" for some time now. Rifles(AR-15s)are being handled as handguns on paper. Just ask anyone who's purchased an AR-15 in the past several months.

It's bullshit and it will continue until they are forced to stop.

Really? It was my understanding that this started out as AR-15 lower receivers being treated as a "firearm" and requiring the FFL to record the sales, but that an AR-15 rifle sale wasn't recorded. Don't get me wrong, the receiver issue is BS too, but I guess they're attempting to move to all AR variants (lowers, rifles, and pistols) because no one made enough noise.

I still don't understand on what authority they are making this "policy change", given that the definition of a firearm as per the UFA hasn't changed since is passage in 1995.

As for the Corbett's office, he's likely not saying anything because:

- The AG's office is part of the Executive, so they work FOR the governor
- There's talk he's planning a gubernatorial run, and he doesn't want to make any waves with voters on the other side of the issue.

It's still worth contacting the AG's office though, and ask why the Executive is enforcing a law which doesn't exist.

[phillyd2]

My understanding was the same as CR. What is the 'rational' for this...if true?

[GunLawyer001]

Originally Posted by phillyd2

My understanding was the same as CR. What is the 'rational' for this...if true?

I looked into this last month, and I believe that the PSP has not yet given any dealers written, formal instructions to change anything yet.

The plan to treat virgin receivers the same way as pistols is based on language that requires all firearms (broadly defined, not the narrow default definition) to be sold only to same-state residents, EXCEPT for rifles and shotguns, and to fill out the 2nd form for all firearms EXCEPT rifles and shotguns.

A stripped, virgin receiver is neither a pistol, rifle, nor shotgun, so it's not excepted from the "all firearms" requirements. If it were a rifle, for example, then you couldn't build it into a pistol without violating the NFA, which makes it a felony to make anything from a "rifle" that has an overall length under 26" or a barrel under 16". Since a virgin lower isn't a rifle, you can make it a pistol without committing any felonies.

However, a completed rifle certainly IS a "rifle", so it IS excepted from the requirements that apply to "all firearms except rifles or shotguns". That 2nd form is set up that unless you have a barrel under 15" (I don't know why it's 15" instead of 16") or a completed overall length under 26", you don't put any details about the gun in, so what exactly is the PSP being told?

If this goes to court, as it almost certainly will, the PSP should win on the stripped receiver issue, but lose on the completed rifle.

[phillyd2]

Originally Posted by GunLawyer001

If this goes to court, as it almost certainly will, the PSP should win on the stripped receiver issue, but lose on the completed rifle.

Great insight as usual, thanks! I wonder if the fact that the 'rifle' is so modular would effect any possible ruling.

[GunLawyer001]

Originally Posted by phillyd2

Great insight as usual, thanks! I wonder if the fact that the 'rifle' is so modular would effect any possible ruling.

It shouldn't, but then again, I'd have bet that a gun registry being "incomplete" wouldn't make it any less illegal.

It wouldn't be a defense to a Federal charge that I made my pistol out of a rifle, if I claimed "but it was so modular". Nor would it be a defense if I sold you my AR pistol FTF without an FFL. A completed rifle is a rifle for all purposes, even if it's physically possible to commit a felony and convert it to a pistol.

For that matter, anyone with a hacksaw can convert any rifle to a pistol with 10 minutes work. Just as illegal, just as possible as swapping a pistol upper onto your AR. In fact, MOST crimes can be committed without tools, like assault, harassment, rape (well, depends on your definitions for that one), murder, kidnapping. Even arson of an apartment building just requires a match. We can't start treating "potential crimes" as "accomplished crimes", not without a trio of psychics and Tom Cruise.

[mikepro8]

Just purchased an AR lower from Young's sporting goods in Northumberland, no "pistol" paperwork, just the transfer.

[Kenshin]

Originally Posted by mikepro8

Just purchased an AR lower from Young's sporting goods in Northumberland, no "pistol" paperwork, just the transfer.

There's another fun thing with that only some of the Dealers are being harassed about putting the pistol on the lower form. And Dicks in Reading has a tag on the R-15 and R-25 saying it requires the pistol form.