Open Carry in a Gun Store Denied.

[Hokkmike]

Went into one of my many great local family owned (not a chain) gunstores Saturday. I was taking my PPS .40 S&W to get fitted for a holster.

When I entered the store I walked to the counter, told the owner I was looking for a holster, handed him the weapon, told him it was clear but that I expected he would want to check for himself. He said that he would; he did and everything was cool.

In the process of looking at various holster choices he told me a story about a (HIS WORDS EVERBODY) long haired, tattoed, and piercing beclad individual who was browsing through the store while openly carrying his 1911. The owner said he was uncomfortable enough in the presence of this cutomer to approach him and ask him to take his gun out to his car or leave the premises. The man apparently was surprised at this reaction by a gun store owner and proceeded to engage in a long argument about how "we in the gun culture" should understand and support the the right to carry. After the argument the man left in apparent disgust. The owner supposed that he would likely never be back. His final word on the subject to me was that he felt that he has every right, like anyone else, gun store or not, to go "with his gut" when his personal safety is an issue.

I listened, but did not ofter comment either way. My feeling is that he had a "right" to do what he did but that I probably would have not approached the customer in that manner. But then again, I have NOT run a gun store for over 20 years as this man has. Maybe he has learned things over the years?

I ended up with an Elite IWB #6, BTW.

So, what do you think?

[Nic]

Originally Posted by Hokkmike

The man apparently was surprised at this reaction by a gun store owner and proceeded to engage in a long argument about how "we in the gun culture" should understand and support the the right to carry. After the argument the man left in apparent disgust. The owner supposed that he would likely never be back. His final word on the subject to me was that he felt that he has every right, like anyone else, gun store or not, to go "with his gut" when his personal safety is an issue.

Although it is his right to deny, the owner should support open carry in his establishment. I feel the same way towards gun shows.

[Shawn.L]

I think people get all excited and worked up and run to post on teh enternet when someone confronts them about their OC. And they leave out the part about how they present themselves.

Ive never had any problems OCing in what you might be led to belive is a very anti city, Pittsburgh. All over the place.

but then again, I am clean cut, dress nice, and friendly.

I bet you if I dressed up in all black, didnt shave or wash, put on some ratty shoes, and walked around with a nasty demenor all day I could come running to tell everyone about how the man violated my rights too.

now, there are some very good examples of overzealous authority figures acting under the color of law to suppress right they dont like, sometimes I feel they get lost in the noise of every asshole who gets pissed cause the bookstore doesnt like them OCing.

If some maniac looking dude came into my store, Id feel them out with a little conversation maybe first.

your friends shop? Its his. As far as I care he can run it however he sees fit, and if he felt unsafe then it seems reasonable to me to address that.

[BTA88]

While I wouldn't support a gun store that denies individuals the right to carry, open or concealed, or who profiles its customers, I do respect the right of the owner to make whatever rules he feels are nessecary to keep his store as safe and friendly as possible.

If I were you, I'd have taken my business elsewhere, but that's just me. I'm picky about who I support.

And the OCer described sounds like it could easily have been one of any number of the more knowledgeable and experienced members on this forum. That's the part that annoys me the most.

[NikeBauer21]

As a private business, he had every right to remove the customer from his shop. Now, should he be profiling his customers/potential customers? Well, that's entirely up to him. I personally don't think it's good for business... That guy could have been the primary support for the business... maybe he was a millionaire, with decieving looks, and was looking for a business to frequent at. Maybe he was trouble... That's the problem with profiling.

Personally, I may have kept an eye on him, but I don't think I would have removed him immediately.. JMO

[Shawn.L]

Originally Posted by BTA88

While I wouldn't support a gun store that denies individuals the right to carry, open or concealed, or who profiles its customers, I do respect the right of the owner to make whatever rules he feels are nessecary to keep his store as safe and friendly as possible.

If I were you, I'd have taken my business elsewhere, but that's just me. I'm picky about who I support.

And the OCer described sounds like it could easily have been one of any number of the more knowledgeable and experienced members on this forum. That's the part that annoys me the most.

I certainly expect a gun store, more than say a lollipop stand, to make judgment calls on its customers.

If someone seems sketchy, nervous, has someone with them checking everything out but they fill out the paperwork................

[Yoder]

You can and should always judge a book by it's cover I always say. If you don't want to be treated like a dirtbag stop taking pride in looking like one.

[camper]

He has the right to deny open carry in his store, and we have the right to not shop there as form of protest.

Who knows, he probably gets enough business from the anti's from NY and NJ that he doesn't have to worry about offending a gun enthusiast who openly carry's.

camper

[ImminentDanger]

This subject of Private Property Rights is particularly interesting because, to a great extent, it can be equated to creating a small fiefdom wherein the owner/manager creates their own form of government.

Further interest is piqued by the type of governing that actually takes place within these fiefdoms.

The United States of America is founded on some very strong principles of equality and fair play, even if originally the necessities of those principles were not fully explored. However, having had two-hundred-plus years to consider those principles, we as citizens have demanded that great attention be paid to our rights, especially those outlined in the Bill of Rights.

The very fact that they are rights, in most cases, means the governing entities 'acknowledge' those rights, rather than 'confer' them. Therefore, it is a difficult and demanding task to deprive citizens of their rights, even when it is agreed that they should be so deprived.

Now, back to Private Property fiefdoms.

Where individuals have the most authority to govern their environment by their own principles, that is, within their own Private Property, it seems that the highly tauted ideals of freedom may be far less embraced than one might expect.

Food for thought....

... Stay Safe ...
ID

[t1m0thy]

Not a gun store that I would patronage.