OC today Dormont Pa paid off

[ar15jules]

Originally Posted by Guns4Fun

What is this lurking thing you post of? You have nearly 1300 posts. Usually that is a comment made by a noob----did you fall off a bridge and forget you post here a lot? . Just messin with ya---like i said, most noobs start out with that phrase.

I could not agree more with you comments though. Good post.

I did fall off a bridge so to speak. This place was turning into a funny farm. It has gone from a great place to discuss firearms to an open carry activism forum. That is fine if that is what it is, I just have no use belonging to a group that will no doubt be labeled as such. I have posted in the past, and choose not to now. This particular thread caught my eye, and thought I would post something that no one else even considered. People need to realize that like any other tool, if you don't have the common sense to use it properly, you shouldn't even be holding in your hand. Going back to jump off the bridge now, I have said my bit...

[Lycanthrope]

I used to party like a rock star at the Vasta/Tom's Diner....never had an issue, even late at night.

Was it a Phillips head?

Lycanjustcuriousthrope

[Evolution]

Originally Posted by ar15jules

I did fall off a bridge so to speak. This place was turning into a funny farm. It has gone from a great place to discuss firearms to an open carry activism forum. That is fine if that is what it is, I just have no use belonging to a group that will no doubt be labeled as such. I have posted in the past, and choose not to now. This particular thread caught my eye, and thought I would post something that no one else even considered. People need to realize that like any other tool, if you don't have the common sense to use it properly, you shouldn't even be holding in your hand. Going back to jump off the bridge now, I have said my bit...

Well if people wouldn't infringe on our rights as citizens then open carry wouldn't be an issue. No one is forcing you to be here. No disrespect.

[ar15jules]

Originally Posted by jcheinaman

Well if people wouldn't infringe on our rights as citizens then open carry wouldn't be an issue. No one is forcing you to be here. No disrespect.

No offense taken. It is what it is.
Jules

[rtrageser]

Originally Posted by jcheinaman

If you draw and the thread subsides you can't fire. You should not live by that statement. Many times a weapon being presented causes the attack to cease.

I understand what you are trying to say, but i don't agree with it as applied to what i said. Right after the quote that you copied, I said this:

I am not going to draw to try to strike fear in the person or to try to get them to back away. If i have to draw, it is because i have absolutely no other option and no way out of the situation other than to shoot that person.

I know that if the threat subsides that you can't shoot, but the only way that i wouldn't is if the guy turned and ran.

[ar15jules]

Originally Posted by Lycanthrope

I used to party like a rock star at the Vasta/Tom's Diner....never had an issue, even late at night.

Was it a Phillips head?

Lycanjustcuriousthrope

I tried to rep you, but I am spent. Love Tom's, and again, you have made me piss my pants.

[TaePo]

An arguement can be made that no reasonable person, with no nefarious intent, would continue to approach an individual who:

Upon initial approach, the OP UNSNAPPED his holster.
Suspect continues approach.
OP places HAND ON HOLSTERED weapon.
Suspect asks, "Are you a cop?" No. Continues approach.

This would speak volumes.

But it is true that there are no guarantees when it comes to juries.

This may be where OC has it's biggest advantage:
No OC means most of the people on the jury will think, man with gun bad, screwdriver man neutral. OC might let people know that owning and carrying for defense is normal.

[DaveM55]

Originally Posted by ar15jules

I have been lurking for the past two months or so, but feel compelled to type something here. Was the OP in fear for his life or severe bodily injury? Who really knows but him. But, with that said, let me state a "what if " here. I know, I hate what ifs, and Monday morning quarterbacks as much as the next guy.

So I am in Dormont helping a buddy put in a chain link fence. I am filthy dirty. Stand 6"3, weigh about 285 on the hoof. Goatee, bald. Wearing jeans, boots, a muscle shirt and a bandana. Head down toward Banskville and blow a fucking tire on my SUV. I go to get the spare down, and the damn mechanism is all buggered up from road salt. THe screwdriver in my tool box isn't cutting the mustard. Hmmmmm, someone must have a prybar or bigger tire iron, ya know, the one ended kind with the big pry bar on the other end. Hey look, a work truck up the road getting gas at the Sunoco. Most work trucks are well stocked with shit like that. I approach the OP who is instantly intimidated by my "skel" appearance. I was once cast as a "skel" on NYPD blue, but I didn't take the job. Anyway, as I approach him, I see him place his hand on a firearm. WTF? Hey man, you a cop or something I ask. I know a few LEOs myself, and even one who works in Dormont. Next thing I see is the gas nozzle coming up at me, and the douche bag is drawing his pistol. I momentarily liken him to a modern day Berard Goetz, and laugh to myself that he may be known in the future as the "Sunoco Vigialante". Anyway, I stop his obvious threat. C'mon, I want to ask for a prybar, and he is drawing on me. I just happened to be exercising my rights.

So, did the OP make the story up? If not, did he actually believe that he was in fear of his life or severe bodily injury while at a gas pump in broad daylight while on one of the most heavily traveled roads in Pittsburgh? Only he knows the answer. But, before ANYONE here tells someone else when or when not to draw a firearm based on what YOU may do, think about the situation that I provided above. ONLY the OP can decide if he needed to act. Personally, I think he if so full of shit, his eyes are brown.
Jules out....

I agree with your thoughts on this one. No one except the OP knows for sure what did or didn't happen. The point I got from your post is the OP MAY have pulled his firearm way too quickly.

[PennsyPlinker]

Is the story true? I don't know. I don't really care either. I don't have the time or the desire to become the internet story verification police. If the guy is lying, it will come out eventually.

But I can tell you this. I make decisions every day as to who gets into my personal space and who doesn't. If I don't like the way you look, smell, talk, whatever, you aren't going to get close to me - especially if you are carrying something that could be construed as a weapon in your hand. Sorry. If you want something from me, speak from a safe distance for us both. I have no problem telling someone to stay where they are or suffer the consequences.

People talk about situational awareness all the time. Well this one is a biggie. If you are going to be situationally aware, then you need to profile every single person who comes within range of you. Forget the politically correct crap. While there are some exceptions, and we can be fooled from time to time, there are certain types of people who tend to present certain appearances. If you are one of those who has that appearance, but not those characteristics, and wonder why people are always afraid or wary of you, this is why. Sorry, that's life. Deal with it.

Know what? If you like to walk up close to people you don't know, in an unusual setting, with a tool in your hand, you're stupid. You don't know who is carrying a gun, or who is going to freak out because they had a close call in the past. If you think it is innocent and normal to approach someone with their hand on their gun, then you are really stupid! That's just the way life is. And just because you have never seen it or heard of it happening doesn't mean it never happens.

I'm sure someone will show up to call me paranoid now. They always do. How do I know that? I'm paranoid, that's why! But in all seriousness, situational awareness is not something you turn on and turn off as the mood suits you, or if you are in a "good" neighborhood, etc. Situational awareness means you are aware of your surroundings all the time, and you are constantly evaluating them. It does not take a lot of time or energy to be aware, but it does take attention. You can't pay attention to what is around you if you have ear buds stuffed into your head, or a cell phone glued to your ear. You can't pay attention to what is around you if you are constantly texting back and forth with your girlfriend or your best buddy. You can't be situationally aware if you are politically correct, because it might offend someone. No smiley here, I am serious. Know what? I don't care. I don't care if someone's finer sensibilities are offended. If I don't like the way they look or act, I am going to make sure they know I know they are there. And I am not some sniveling coward with the attitude that if I look at someone they are going to get mad and hurt me. I don't stare, but I do look around. All the time.

That's how I practice situational awareness. If anyone here has a problem with that attitude, well then, don't get too close - especially if you are working on your car.

[Michele]

Might be a slight hijack but.....

I can't help but wonder......

What if the "victim" (op) in this episode (exact story) was/is a female?

Would you still say he/she drew too quickly? What if it was your wife telling the story. She doesn't draw. Quite possible the first thing you'd say to her when she got home would be "you carry a gun, why didn't you pull it".

In the op it states that the "skel" knew the op had a gun. I don't care if the guy didn't speak English. A gun is a universal language. You don't have to speak or understand native tongue to understand what a gun is.

I'm kind of taking a special interest in the way this thread is going. I being female, would have done the exact same thing, in the exact same circumstances. Would I have been wrong?

My take on this story is. The skel saw the gun, asked about it (are you a cop). He felt "comfortable" enough when the op said no to being a cop. He got closer and closer. Why?

Some of you are saying that he drew too quickly, or he shouldn't have drawn at all, because, there was no danger. I see different. Although, I am seeing this through female eyes.