Pa. Patriot ARRESTED at the OC dinner @ The Old Country Buffet in Dickson City 5/9

[Tsgtbob]

In addition to the various and sundry violations of the Second Amendment of the Constitution, I'm smelling a violation of the First Amendment as well.

The LEO's have no place to say what can, and can't be videotaped. OCB (being a private establishment) CAN tell you to stop taping, but a LEO cannot tell you to stop recording.

I was threatened with arrest for performing my job a few weeks ago. A counter threat of the Corporation's Lawyers stopped the LEO, but, I have "proper" credentials.

Mrs. Pa Patriot, I will dig out the portions of the Media Law briefing, and forward them to you.

I also smell a column coming up. (Yes, I'm in the "liberal media" and the trampling of Socialist Boots is beginning to piss me off royally!)

[blueeyedbyrd]

just got a chance to check the computer, i don't think theres anything more I can say that hasn't been said before. But PA Patriot you have my support and if theres anything I can do just let me know. Also if theres anything in the works for later this week I'll try to make it out, but with the new driving job it's hard to say when I'll be home.

[BullfrogKen]

Originally Posted by doug

I agree with you there, that press release from Mike wasn't helpful at all.

The point of press releases is to get them picked up by the press.

Starting off with SIEG HAIL is a sure way to get your press release ignored.

*sigh*

The best thing that could happen is it got ignored. God forbid a major news network actually use it. The way the media interprets things it doesn't understand . . . . this piece runs a significant risk for publicity damage.

XYZ news - SIEG HEIL! This appears to be the slogan of a conservative pro-gun rights group in Central Pennsylvania. According to a press release, members of a right wing group organized an outing to meet in Dickson City at a local buffet restaurant. And the members weren't the only ones there. They brought their guns along with them. A local concerned citizen called the Police who arrived within minutes.

Officers from every surrounding jurisdiction questioned the group, arrested their leader Rich Banks, and confiscated an unconfirmed number of guns. XYZ news reporter, Nervous Nancy asked Dickson City Police Chief William Stadnitski if he was aware of any neo-Nazi groups operating in the area:

"Pennsylvania has small concentrations of white supremacist groups actively operating within it. I'm not familiar with this group, but we're looking into it to see if there are any connections. The press release containing the neo-Nazi slogan concerns us, though. We certainly don't want hate groups walking the streets of our community armed.

Get my point, fellas? It is NEVER a good idea to put pen to paper (or fingers to keyboard) while angered. Take some time to digest it, then as best you can write an objective, concise piece free from emotionally-charged and loaded words.

Who is your audience here? Gun owners? We are persuaded this is repugnant without riling us up. The audience of a press release is those outside your group. They don't know your terms, your catch-phrases, and the history behind the matter. Well-written pieces that reach them appeal to them on some common ground, and when they begin to identify with the victim, they become sympathetic and supportive.

This piece doesn't do that.


I know its not my place to say it, but I will anyway. Stop forwarding that press release. Even though it was written with the best of intentions, it is harmful. I'll say it again: It is worse than ineffective; it is harmful. I've already began seeing negative responses elsewhere within our own ranks from the way this was presented.

[Pro2A]

Originally Posted by ALS

Also sent the PR to Quinn in the morning. So hopefully he'll make a comment on it tomorrow. Quinn & Rose in the morning

I used to listen to him a lot in the morning when I delivered papers in the winter. Not so much now that i have to be at work by 6am most mornings.

[pex]

Originally Posted by BullfrogKen

Get my point, fellas? It is NEVER a good idea to put pen to paper (or fingers to keyboard) while angered. Take some time to digest it, then as best you can write an objective, concise piece free from emotionally-charged and loaded words.

Who is your audience here? Gun owners? We are persuaded this is repugnant without riling us up. The audience of a press release is those outside your group. They don't know your terms, your catch-phrases, and the history behind the matter. Well-written pieces that reach them appeal to them on some common ground, and when they begin to identify with the victim, they become sympathetic and supportive.

Lol, guy, interesting and astute pick-up.

You seem to miss, however, that the moral high ground of objectivity using the most succinct and correct wording will still be lost and distorted on the uneducated and willfully ignorant enemy!

Consider that a people has been barraged by all sides of the argument since the inception of the US, and they, as an apparent majority, choose control.

[BullfrogKen]

Originally Posted by pex

Lol, guy, interesting and astute pick-up.

You seem to miss, however, that the moral high ground of objectivity using the most succinct and correct wording will still be lost and distorted on the uneducated and willfully ignorant enemy!

Consider that a people has been barraged by all sides of the argument since the inception of the US, and they, as an apparent majority, choose control.

I disagree.

If 10 years ago, during the high point of the Clinton Administration, you'd have told me that within a decade a citizen could get a shall-issue permit in roughly 40 of the 50 states, I'd have thought you were smoking the wacky weed. No Democrat candidate today will run on a gun-control platform in a contested district. Ed Rendell's lastest bully move this fall in front of the Judiciary Committee was soundly defeated. Soundly. To the point of embarassment.


Look, do whatever you want. But this press release was harmful. Press Releases aren't for you and me. They are aimed towards the Joe Q. citizen unaware of your plight.


An old adage exists in sales. People don't think a certain way, or make certain decisions because the salesman tells them they ought to. The best salesmen create an atmosphere in which the customer decides for himself that the salesperson is right. Its an art. And when it works, the person who believes he arrived at the decision after deliberating it himself is the most ardent supporter.


Viewing the uneducated as an enemy is bound to make them one.

[Steve in PA]

Originally Posted by stevieb92

WOW.

I really don't know where to start. I am just appalled at the behavior of the PD. Don't they have anything better to do than harass their employers (taxpayers)? They think their s#%t doesn't stink and anyone should do as they say because they said so? Unbelievable.

Everyone involved has my full support in any way I can help out. Just name it.

Gotta run right now. I will post more later.

Hopefully this issue/thread won't turn into an anti-LEO thing, because some LEO's do know the laws.

My wife and I had a discussion about this incident the other night, about what is covered in the police academy. I told her that OC is NOT covered or even addressed by MPOETC. Maybe this incident will change that.....but I'm not holding my breath.

Anything I know about gun laws I learned on my own, even before becoming a firearms instructor (LEO). For the last few years I have taught a module on the gun laws of PA, to include OC as well as CC, and all things involved. To my knowledge I have not heard of anyone else including this in their training. Hopefully........there are other FI's who teach this stuff.

In a situation like this, crap rolls up hill. So while the officers at the scene should be held accountable for their actions, so should their chief, firearms instructor and MPOETC who mandate yearly in-service updates to keep officers current on laws, etc.

Lastly, and this can get a bit touchy, the public we serve are not our "employers", bosses, etc. Our employers are the municipalities we serve. This does not forgive the officers for not knowing the laws or their actions.

[Emptymag]

BullfrogKen,
I agree with you to a point, in that my first reaction to seeing the title, was "Holy crap, as if the antis don't already consider gun owners to be Nazis!"

After reading a few sentences, I realized the correlation between Nazis and the behavior exhibited by the police on the scene. It made perfect sense.(to me, and I'm not that bright!)

At the same time, making sense, is not high on the priority list of the antis, so they will likely read into it what they WANT to.

I'm not losing any sleep over it though. It's out there. It isn't going to go away, so the best thing to do is be able to show the true meaning of those words to anyone who wishes to distort them for their own agenda.

[jb12string]

I mentioned this in an existing thread at 1911forum and I plan on posting it to 1911forum and shootersforum when the PAFOA press release is issued. I am new here so I haven't had much interaction with anyone here, but after reading some of the threads about your handling of the gnbrotz issue and reading the accounts of what happened from those present Friday night, you guys have my respect. Best of luck PA Patriot, something tells me you'll do just fine.

[danp]

Originally Posted by BullfrogKen

Who is your audience here? Gun owners? We are persuaded this is repugnant without riling us up. The audience of a press release is those outside your group. They don't know your terms, your catch-phrases, and the history behind the matter. Well-written pieces that reach them appeal to them on some common ground, and when they begin to identify with the victim, they become sympathetic and supportive.

+1.

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