Pa. Patriot ARRESTED at the OC dinner @ The Old Country Buffet in Dickson City 5/9

[TonyF]

Originally Posted by fingers80002

The way I see it, it is an "injustice system", and an " illegal system".

Whatever you want to call it, it is what it is.

If you bloody my nose, I will do 10X worse to you!

The "bloody nose" reference was symbolic.

Wanna come over and try?

WTF is that supposed to mean?

[pahandgunner]

Originally Posted by Statkowski

Dickson City Borough's liability insurance has a $25,000 deductible due to previous legal

I can't believe any officer would not have their own mil or multi mil policy. Even teachers do. If they don't, shame on them.

[Pa. Patriot]

Originally Posted by TonyF

I have to disagree with this particular analogy because soldiers are ordered to deploy and don't have a choice but I do understand your point.

They volunteer (in America) to be warriors, with the known risk of seeing "war".

Originally Posted by TonyF

Look, I don't disagree that outrage is justified. But there used to be an officer on the department in my town years ago who was a class A, dyed in the wool rambo type asshole. I firmly believe there are still some like that on the job. The odds favor it. Encountering one of these types who "knows the law" will not end amicably or peacefully no matter how polite we are.

Agree. But again, I'm not sure how knowing the risk diminishes the result.

[TonyF]

Originally Posted by Pa. Patriot

They volunteer (in America) to be warriors, with the known risk of seeing "war".

OK.

Agree. But again, I'm not sure how knowing the risk diminishes the result.

I wasn't attempting to make a connection between the risk and the result. Just making a point that social change = upheaval (to a greater or lesser degree). The civil rights movement, the gay rights movement, women's rights, the protests at the democratic convention in 1968, etc.

It involves sacrifice and people can, and have, gotten hurt in the process.

[mjfletcher]

Originally Posted by TonyF

I have to disagree with this particular analogy because soldiers are ordered to deploy and don't have a choice but I do understand your point.

Being as we have a volunteer military they do have a choice. They know when they sign up they could be deployed which could result in PTSD, making it a completely valid analogy.

OCers voluntarily do so knowing there is a risk they will be hassled by LEO which could result in a traumatic experience for themself and their family.
Soldiers voluntarily sign up knowing there is a risk they will be deployed to a combat zone which could result in a traumatic experience for themself and their family.

[Pa. Patriot]

Originally Posted by TonyF

I wasn't attempting to make a connection between the risk and the result. Just making a point that social change = upheaval (to a greater or lesser degree). The civil rights movement, the gay rights movement, women's rights, the protests at the democratic convention in 1968, etc.

It involves sacrifice and people can, and have, gotten hurt in the process.

Agree. Pretty much a given. Again, I guess I didn't/don't understand the relation to the current topic. Apparently that was not your intent anyway... So there it is.

[PeteG]

Originally Posted by ThomasJ

Preposterous. What other means of redress does one have when life, liberty, or property is infringed upon - especially by government violating the constitution?

Preposterous?

First, I do not consider it a good thing that one is FORCED to resort to litigation in order to redress violations of civil rights. I think it is an unfortunate (bad) thing, even though unavoidable. Ergo, a law suit is a bad thing to have.

Second, there are other means of redress. One example would be a sit-down with the local PD. Another example would be passive, non-violent resistence. Another example would be armed resistance. Another example would be to organize policitally and get the Borough counsel (who whoever runs the show out there) un-elected, and fire the Police. There are lots of examples. (I think litigation is a good choice in most cases. It is certainly not the only choice.)

Or, you could call people names like the rest of the kids.

[Lycanthrope]

Originally Posted by TonyF

It involves sacrifice and people can, and have, gotten hurt in the process.

I can understand that very well and I very much agree with Tony.

What is right is often full of risk....and sometimes pain. And...occasionally.....it can be totally unjust....with no reparations.

Not saying anyone has to lie down for it and not to criticize past events at all...who could know? Doing something is more effective for change than doing nothing.

But....given current events, future activists need to think about possible scenarios of unjust reactions.....and minimize the losses....while maintaining the best option to educate where the most people will listen. There are certain ways to state causes that can actually cause deficits in the planned goals.

Just ask D.A.R.E.....you know...the drug awareness program that was shown to increase drug use in schools due to poor adherence to a strict methodology.

In the OC case....we don't have a proven methodology.

It's not what is right.....we lost that. Plenty of injustices in the world.... It's how we get back to what is right and that may take specific tactics. We should be talking about that......shouldn't we?.

Tony has a valid point.

Lycanswimminwithsharksthrope

[fingers80002]

Originally Posted by TonyF

Whatever you want to call it, it is what it is.



The "bloody nose" reference was symbolic.



WTF is that supposed to mean?

The rules for posting prevent that.

[PeteG]

Originally Posted by fingers80002

The way I see it, it is an "injustice system", and an " illegal system".
If you bloody my nose, I will do 10X worse to you!

Wanna come over and try?

Sure you will ... unless the government for some reason decides to swat you like a fly. In that case, you won't be a greasy spot on the pavement, and your only real hope will be other people standing with you. The most likely candidates for that job are the people you are now insulting.

The "come over and try" remark is childish and out of line. Calm yourself.