Open carry in restaurants

[Bersa45]

In Ohio you cannot carry in a restaurant that serves alcohol. I know in Pa you can thats why we frequent Erie alot for dinner and shopping. My questions is can you open carry in a place that serves alcohol such as the Road House or Quaker Stake and Lube or anyother place for that matter. Thanks for the replies.

[Pa. Patriot]

Yes

There is no distinction in the PA UFA that prohibits carry (of any type) in places that serve/sell alcohol

[knight0334]

Yes, its legal...

You can even open carry in a full fledged bar, club or tavern in PA legally. Generally not advised though..


If it isn't a: courthouse, K-12 school, state(reg) or federal park, casino(reg), dept of state building(reg), or other places by federal law - it is perfectly legal.

[mjf]

Yeah, there's nothing stopping you, legally speaking, from openly carrying at a crazy night club... Personally, I just think that's asking for trouble though.

[LittleRedToyota]

many night clubs with someone working the door prolly have policies against firearms and would not let someone in who was open carrying...but all they can do is not let you in or ask you to leave if you are already inside. (if you refuse to leave, then you can get charged with tresspassing.)

in general in PA, a business can prohibit guns on their premises, but that prohibition carries no weight of law (which means violating it is not, in and of itself, illegal). all they can do is ask you to leave. if you don't leave, then you are open to actual criminal charges (for tresspassing).

(ETA: be aware, though, that open carry *in a vehicle* in PA is illegal unless you have a carry permit...the permit can be from any state, but you have to have one or you are breaking the law in PA by carrying a loaded firearm in a vehicle even if it is in the open.)

[imperialism2024]

Originally Posted by knight0334

Yes, its legal...

You can even open carry in a full fledged bar, club or tavern in PA legally. Generally not advised though..


If it isn't a: courthouse, K-12 school, state(reg) or federal park, casino(reg), dept of state building(reg), or other places by federal law - it is perfectly legal.

That's not entirely accurate. Unless self-defense, i.e. a common reason stated on a PA LTCF for carrying a firearm, is not a "lawful purpose", carrying at a K-12 school should be legal. But if found out and charged, it would likely require a long legal battle to prove the point. It may be one of those circumstances where "concealed is concealed" is a good philosophy. See statute below:

"§ 912. Possession of weapon on school property.

(a) Definition.--Notwithstanding the definition of "weapon" in section 907 (relating to possessing instruments of crime), "weapon" for purposes of this section shall include but not be limited to any knife, cutting instrument, cutting tool, nun-chuck stick, firearm, shotgun, rifle and any other tool, instrument or implement capable of inflicting serious bodily injury.

(b) Offense defined.--A person commits a misdemeanor of the first degree if he possesses a weapon in the buildings of, on the grounds of, or in any conveyance providing transportation to or from any elementary or secondary publicly-funded educational institution, any elementary or secondary private school licensed by the Department of Education or any elementary or secondary parochial school.

(c) Defense.--It shall be a defense that the weapon is possessed and used in conjunction with a lawful supervised school activity or course or is possessed for other lawful purpose."

Sorry to go a little OT there, but it's a common misconception that school carry is explicitly banned.

[knight0334]

Originally Posted by imperialism2024

That's not entirely accurate. Unless self-defense, i.e. a common reason stated on a PA LTCF for carrying a firearm, is not a "lawful purpose", carrying at a K-12 school should be legal. But if found out and charged, it would likely require a long legal battle to prove the point. It may be one of those circumstances where "concealed is concealed" is a good philosophy. See statute below:

"§ 912. Possession of weapon on school property.

(a) Definition.--Notwithstanding the definition of "weapon" in section 907 (relating to possessing instruments of crime), "weapon" for purposes of this section shall include but not be limited to any knife, cutting instrument, cutting tool, nun-chuck stick, firearm, shotgun, rifle and any other tool, instrument or implement capable of inflicting serious bodily injury.

(b) Offense defined.--A person commits a misdemeanor of the first degree if he possesses a weapon in the buildings of, on the grounds of, or in any conveyance providing transportation to or from any elementary or secondary publicly-funded educational institution, any elementary or secondary private school licensed by the Department of Education or any elementary or secondary parochial school.

(c) Defense.--It shall be a defense that the weapon is possessed and used in conjunction with a lawful supervised school activity or course or is possessed for other lawful purpose."

Sorry to go a little OT there, but it's a common misconception that school carry is explicitly banned.

I know the laws, if you do a search for any of my prior posts on the subject you will see that I point out specifically the "other lawful purposes". However, there is no case or coded law defining what that term means. Any one of us can end up being the test case. So in short, it is advised to not carry there - especially if you dont have a state issued LTCF.

Another thing that does make it off-limits is the federal law. If you dont have a license/permit, you violated the federal law. . ...thus making the school off-limits.

In all general, the schools are off-limits by federal law if you do not have a license issued by the state in which the school you happen to come within 1000ft of. Even if liberally construed to allow permits/licenses honored by agreement in PA, the OP is an OH resident and asumingly has a OH license - the OH license is no good in PA thus no good under the GFSZ. This is assuming the OP has no PA license due to his question of open carrying.


http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/ht...2----000-.html

§ 922. Unlawful acts
(q)(2)
(A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.
(B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—
(i) on private property not part of school grounds;
(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
(iii) that is—
(I) not loaded; and
(II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
(v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;
(vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; or
(vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.

[steamtownwelder]

Originally Posted by knight0334

You can even open carry in a full fledged bar, club or tavern in PA legally. Generally not advised though..

Why would you say that?

[knight0334]

Originally Posted by steamtownwelder

Why would you say that?

Alcohol doesn't mix well with firearms. If you drink, your abilities to think rationally starts to diminish with the first drink.

I'm very pro-open carry, however you do leave yourself open to a gun grab. Even if you aren't drinking, other drunk people are very capable of doing dumb things. If you are gonna carry in a bar, logically its best to conceal it just to avoid that probability. Rarely do I go to a bar anymore, but I do carry when I do. It remains covered, and if I do drink - it's in moderation.

[Thekatar]

Originally Posted by knight0334

I'm very pro-open carry, however you do leave yourself open to a gun grab.

You're asking for trouble making a statement like that on this website.

Prepare to be hounded until you "confess" the error of your ways.

Like they say: "No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!"