Two shot dead, Sat 6-27 in Northern Liberties, Philadelphia

[mythaeus]

Originally Posted by Asterix909

For most of us in Happy Valley 'The first shooting in my neighborhood in a while' would be more like 'the first shooting in my neighborhood ever'

Jeeze, just thinking back the last shooting I can even think of in State College was when some crazy got shot by the police outside a Christian radio station he had threatened... and that was years ago.

You'd think that everyone in your area (philly general) would carry for protection- I just don't get why so much of the city is anti-2a...

You can post the same question to Baltimore, Chicago, DC, LA, NYC and many other big cities. It's the silly government here that THINKS the city is against 2A and behave that way, not so much the citizenry. I haven't met a single anti in this neighborhood and if they had negative impressions, I've managed to at least pointed those out as unwarranted. We have 144 murders as of 6/30 for a city of 1.5M people. The majority are in (let's just say) not so nice neighborhoods. Philly on the news is not really Philly-represented. There are way too many good things here to be anywhere else.

ETA: Also, at least in Philly, we still enjoy most of the gun rights as the rest of the state of PA, compared to many other big cities

Al

[he11zna]

Originally Posted by mythaeus

ETA: Also, at least in Philly, we still enjoy most of the gun rights as the rest of the state of PA, compared to many other big cities

Al

+1 to that Al.

We could live in any of the cities you stated (Baltimore, Chicago, DC, LA, NYC)
All of which have much less tolerance for firearms.

continue with the Philly bashing...

[Asterix909]

Originally Posted by mythaeus

It's the silly government here that THINKS the city is against 2A and behave that way, not so much the citizenry.

Is the gov't not put in place by the citizenry? If I am wrong, I'm wrong, but the fact that these elected officials are elected you would think that the mass that elected them is of similar mindset, no? Of course, possibly they were elected for other values, and now everyone is just getting shafted by the 2a part?

Originally Posted by he11zna

continue with the Philly bashing...

No bashing here, its just my understanding that a majority of the Philly area populace (US populace, at that) is generally aligned with the government. I think you two are misinterpreting my surprise of exposure and acceptance to crime as some sort of 'anti-Philly, you guys have no rights, ya'll suck' rant- which could not be farther from the truth.

I apologize if I am way off in assuming that the populace elected officials with similar values and hence making generalized assumptions about the majority populace of the city based on those officials. My town's gov't reflects the majority of my towns citizenry, as does the state, and the federal gov't... that's all I know and as such assumed it was the case in Philly too.

Regardless, I am willing to bet my town is much more anti 2a than Philly is (in general terms) and I would never accuse anyone for bashing State COllege about it purely because they would be spot on.

[mythaeus]

Originally Posted by Asterix909

Is the gov't not put in place by the citizenry? If I am wrong, I'm wrong, but the fact that these elected officials are elected you would think that the mass that elected them is of similar mindset, no? Of course, possibly they were elected for other values, and now everyone is just getting shafted by the 2a part?

No bashing here, its just my understanding that a majority of the Philly area populace (US populace, at that) is generally aligned with the government. I think you two are misinterpreting my surprise of exposure and acceptance to crime as some sort of 'anti-Philly, you guys have no rights, ya'll suck' rant- which could not be farther from the truth.

I apologize if I am way off in assuming that the populace elected officials with similar values and hence making generalized assumptions about the majority populace of the city based on those officials. My town's gov't reflects the majority of my towns citizenry, as does the state, and the federal gov't... that's all I know and as such assumed it was the case in Philly too.

Regardless, I am willing to bet my town is much more anti 2a than Philly is (in general terms) and I would never accuse anyone for bashing State COllege about it purely because they would be spot on.

Nah...I don't think you're bashing at all. No doubt the government was elected by the people, but you know pretty well that Obama doesn't represent you or nearly half of the country. Obama and people on his team are in no way representative of the rest of the country on 2A either. The majority of people in Philly are not against 2A (my personal sense, no stats to back it up), they are just apathetic towards the government's stands on the issue. In other words, they vote out of party line mainly on social issues rather than the issue of 2A.

Al

[Asterix909]

Originally Posted by mythaeus

The majority of people in Philly are not against 2A (my personal sense, no stats to back it up), they are just apathetic towards the government's stands on the issue. In other words, they vote out of party line mainly on social issues rather than the issue of 2A.

Understood.
That's the danger of party voting or even single issues voting... You get stuck with all the other issues your candidate might represent. Just gotta decide which you can live with and which you can't... Makes voting so hard, cuz no matter what even when you 'win' you still get a bit of lose, that is, unless you are the elected official then its all win

[mythaeus]

Originally Posted by Asterix909

Understood.
That's the danger of party voting or even single issues voting... You get stuck with all the other issues your candidate might represent. Just gotta decide which you can live with and which you can't... Makes voting so hard, cuz no matter what even when you 'win' you still get a bit of lose, that is, unless you are the elected official then its all win

I've always argued for efforts to "educate" more Democrats about gun rights, at the grassroots level. Simple things like taking them out to shoot or discuss with them about guns. Even if I can get them to roll their eyes each time they hear their candidate talk about gun control, I think it's a good start. You'd be surprised how many of them are extremely receptive or have always been very curious, but don't know where to start. I had a long conversation with one of my neighbors last night about gun rights. He was clearly a Democrat and he asked many good questions and prefixed them with the fact that he doesn't know anything about guns. I'll probably be taking him to the range one of these days.

Apathy, while can be dangerous, is no where near anti. With apathy, it's a lot easier to sway. I find that at least it's somewhat fortunate at apathy is more a case in the constituents here.

Al

[Story]

1. Arrest made - good job, Philly PD!

There has been an arrest in the double murder of a man and woman inside an upscale Northern Liberties apartment last Saturday.

Philadelphia police say 25-year-old Katoya Jones of Northern Liberties has been arrested in connection with the shooting deaths of 34-year-old Rian Thal and 40-year-old Timothy Gilmore last Saturday inside an apartment building near 2nd and Hancock Streets

http://www.kyw1060.com/Woman-Arreste...es-Sla/4726796

2. This article on the ambush is linked from the article above. Four guys, catching the couple in a crossfire - not your typical 'innocent victims of gun violence'. Luckily, no innocent taxpayers were hit.

The video shows four men walking throughout the apartment building at the Piazza, lying in wait for the victims to return home.

One of them acts as a lookout (right), while the other three hole up in a stairwell.

When Rian Thal and Timothy Gilmore emerge from the elevator to their seventh floor, homicide captain James Clark says the pair pause, and look out the window:

"At this point, they actually pinned them between the two sets of shooters. They're synchronized, so they know exactly when they're coming out the elevator. As they do, the two males come from behind them and then they're trapped, because they have a shooter at the other end of the hallway."

Both were shot multiple times.

"This was extremely organized. Here you have four guys, they're all on cell phones together. They're going up the staircases. You have a lookout. He's alerting them when the two decedents are on the way up."

http://www.kyw1060.com/pages/4700542.php

3. That's actually be a pretty tough range scenario. Ok, all you Hard Core pistoleros - if you're walking home with your significant other, how do you shoot your way out of that one?

[Story]

More background on the 'victims'. Fascinating.
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/ho...cmpid=15585797
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/ho...s_complex.html

[MichaelJ]

Originally Posted by Story

3. That's actually be a pretty tough range scenario. Ok, all you Hard Core pistoleros - if you're walking home with your significant other, how do you shoot your way out of that one?

I pull my gold plated Desert Eagle .50 out of my IWB and shoot through the concrete pillars while doing somersaults through the hallway Matrix style.

Lol your question is about as easy to answer as "There is a sniper hidden who has you in their crosshairs. You see a flash of sunlight off the reticle as the sniper takes the hood off the scope. What do you do?!?!"

[sttaffy]

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/ho...cmpid=15585797

The killers are local and were let in by another tenant in the building. Great neighbor, huh?

They arrested the woman from downstairs but the 3 shooters and 1 lookout are still out and about in north philly