"High Noon in Philly"

[TravisBickle]

From the Philadelphia Inqurier



Posted on Sun, Apr. 08, 2007 email thisprint thisreprint or license thisIn Pa., it’s high noon in battle over gun controlAt least 15 firearms bills are back in the legislative pipeline.
By Amy Worden
Inquirer Staff Writer
HARRISBURG - Seven months after a special two-day legislative session on crime in which more than a dozen gun-control bills were defeated, anti-crime advocates are hoping a new climate in Harrisburg will mean http://www.philly.com/inquirer/home_...s.htmlmovement on long-stalled gun-control measures.

The drumbeat for tougher firearms laws, they say, is swelling from people in many quarters, including the governor.

The effort comes at a time when the number of slayings in Philadelphia is edging painfully upward - 105 at last count(midday Friday), the majority of them at the point of a gun. At least 15 bills are back in the pipeline; Gov. Rendell has turned up the volume on his pleas for stronger gun-control measures, and Democrats now control the state House. All this comes at a time when a new poll suggests a majority of Pennsylvanians are willing to accept handgun-sale limits.

But despite the renewed hope - and calls by Rendell, Mayor Street, and mid-sized city mayors from mid-size cities across the state for legislation to /help /reduce gun violence - the bills face an uphill battle in the General Assembly, which is dominated by lawmakers who support gun rights.

From House Speaker Dennis O'Brien (R., Phila.), who blocked gun-control bills as chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, to the current leaders of the committees in the House and Senate, there is reluctance to support gun bills for fear they will fail or bring lawmakers defeat in the next election.

Rep. Dan Surra (D., Elk) said that while he sympathized with residents living in high-crime areas, he could not support any gun-restriction bill because in certain quarters of his district, a hunting stronghold in the north-central part of the state, guns are a single-issue item at the polls.

"They will vote you out on this," Surra said.

Rendell's mention of gun control in his February budget in the Capitol drew a chorus of hisses from Republicans - and likely some Democrats in the Capitol - underscoring the largely geographical, rather than political, divide on the issue.

Rendell, nevertheless, has pressed on, using two high-profile settings - his budget address and a speech at the Pennsylvania Press Club - to ask lawmakers to send him a bill limiting handgun purchases to one a month. Such a bill, Rendell said last month, would still allow a law-abiding individuals to buy 12 handguns a year.

Last week Rendell, while acknowledging his budget and other controversial proposals are weighing on the legislative agenda in the months ahead, Rendell pledged not to give up the effort.

"I'm going to continue to push for one gun a month," he said following a news conference to drum up support for his proposal to lease the Pennsylvania Turnpike.

Still,There is reason for gun-control advocates to be optimistic.

Control of the House changed hands this year, putting Democrats in charge for the first time in a decade. Among the first orders of business for Rep. Tom Caltagirone (D., Berks), the new chairman of the Judiciary Committee, was to schedule the first-ever hearings on gun-control proposals.

And a new poll suggests Pennsylvanians could be softening to the idea of limiting handgun sales to reduce the number of so-called "straw purchases."

"Voters are in a different place than some lawmakers," said Rep. Dwight Evans (D., Phila.), the poll's sponsor and chairman of the House Appropriations Committee.

Evans' poll, which asked 600 residents statewide for their views on various gun-control proposals, showed that 70 percent of the respondents supported a one-handgun-a-month law. Among those queried, 38 percent owned a firearm.

"They realize the need for laws if you really want fundamental change to make it a safer state," said Evans, nowone of/ the most powerful Philadelphia Democrats in the General Assembly. He's running for mayor on the crowded May 15 Democratic ballot.

Crime hit home last year for the one-handgun bill's lead sponsor, Rep. John Myers (D., Phila.), whose son disappeared under mysterious circumstances last August and has yet to be found.

"We have to reduce the availability of guns," said Myers, who has introduced a bill restoringgiving Philadelphia's authority to make its own gun laws.

But deep philosophical differences separate those in rural areas who treasure their Second Amendment rights, and for whom a Winchester .30-06 is for shooting deer, from those in urban areas who associate gun use with murder.

"The feeling out here is that proposals that deal with firearms in general are inched toward the precipice, and once you start eroding Second Amendment rights, it's a cascading effect," Surra, the legislator from northwestern Pennsylvania said.

"Guns are part of our culture, too. The difference is we don't shoot each other," said Surra, who recalls teaching students to build guns in shop class.

And although Evans is determined to get the one-handgun-a-month bill to the floor this year, Caltagirone, the new chairman of the Judiciary Committee, does not think he can deliver it. "I don't have the votes at this point in time," Caltagirone said, adding that he hopes to work on a compromise that could pass.

Clearly, a battle looms over one-handgun-a-month in the Capitol.

"We're opposed, of course," said Melody Zullinger, executive director of Pennsylvania Federation of Sportsmen, an umbrella group representing 300 hunting and outdoor organizations.

The National Rifle Association and the sportsmen's groups know that their members are sensitive about gun control, and the organizations are increasing their efforts to combat the bills pending in Harrisburg. They are planning a rally in the Capitol on April 24.

"All [the laws] do is infringe on law-abiding citizens' rights," Zullinger said. "The criminals get illegal guns on the black market. It's not going to curb the crime problem."

Although gun-rights advocates are concerned about the Democratic majority in the House, they still think they can prevail, she said.

"We still have confidence enough on both sides to stop the bill from getting to the floor, or passing," Zullinger said.

This time around, gun-control groups have a new advocate: Philip R. Goldsmith, Philadelphia's former managing director, who is now president of CeaseFire PA.

"The time is ripe," said Goldsmith, who wants to build a grassroots movement like the one that defeated the controversial pay raise that legislators voted themselves in 2005. "The paradigm is changing on this."

can cut from here on................f Virginia, Maryland and California have enacted laws limiting handgun sales to one a month, and legislatures in eight other states, including Pennsylvania, are considering such bills.

There are few studies tracking the effectiveness of handgun limits, and at least one is 10 years old.

That 1996 study, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, found evidence that Virginia's one-a-month limit reduced by more than half the number of guns traced to Virginia that were used in crimes in the Northeast.

Pennsylvania "is a priority state for us," said Peter Hamm, communications director for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Handgun Violence, which teamed with other gun-control groups to form the coalition Pennsylvanians Against Trafficking Handguns in 2005. "We believe there is enough political ability in the legislature to enact change."

State Sen. Stewart Greenleaf (R., Bucks), chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said he supported one-handgun-a-month but would not bring up a bill for a vote in his committee that is doomed to failure.

"I run what I think I can get through, and this didn't come close to passing," said Greenleaf. "Still, we have to do something that will have an impact. It's a war."



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Contact staff writer Amy Worden at 717-783-2584 or aworden@phillynews.com. Updated 12:00 PM EDTMOST VIEWED
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[Brick]

The last time I checked Philadephia and Pittsburgh combined represented 14% of Pa's population, but they expect 90% of the influence.

[D-FENS]

Originally Posted by Brick

The last time I checked Philadephia and Pittsburgh combined represented 14% of Pa's population, but they expect 90% of the influence.

Depends how you look at it. City pop or the Metro Area pop. I think the Metro Area pop is more reflective of the influence they have.

City pop of Philly is 1.4 and Pittsburgh is .3

The Metro Area of Philly is 5.8 million, Metro Area of Pittsburgh is 2.4 million and the state population is 12.2 million.

That's > 3/4 of the PA population.

*NOTE* Numbers are from Wikipedia and obtained from the 2000 census. All numbers are rounded to the nearest hundred thousand

[TravisBickle]

Originally Posted by Brick

The last time I checked Philadephia and Pittsburgh combined represented 14% of Pa's population, but they expect 90% of the influence.

Their percentage of the population (myself being from Philly) is irrelavent. Rights are rights and the law is the law. Our rights are not subject to the ebb and flow of public opinion or to the most recent crime statistics.

[KeithPA]

That 1996 study, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, found evidence that Virginia's one-a-month limit reduced by more than half the number of guns traced to Virginia that were used in crimes in the Northeast.

Hahaha, the always "honest" AMA. They don't despise guns or anything**

** Denotes sarcasm

[SpeakTrue]

Well here is what I got out of this article:

"State Sen. Stewart Greenleaf (R., Bucks), chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said he supported one-handgun-a-month but would not bring up a bill for a vote in his committee that is doomed to failure."

Even though I have no interest in politicians names generally, I will now remember this name, "State Sen. Stewart Greenleaf (R., Bucks), chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee" as supporting one-handgun-a-month.

And when it comes times to pull that lever in the booth, somehow I will remember that "State Sen. Stewart Greenleaf (R., Bucks), chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee" supports one-handgun-a-month.

And to me, it will not matter who is running against "State Sen. Stewart Greenleaf (R., Bucks), chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee" who supports one-handgun-a-month, they will get my vote.

I would rather vote for another candidate who opposes what I believe in honestly, than a candidate who impliedly supports my position, but secretly supports notions like one-handgun-a-month to kiss up to polls and sound bites.

If the republicans don't stand firmly against gun control and against one-handgun-a-month, then I advocate a one-republican-an-election policy on our part. That's right, one-republican-an-election gets in.

Some day the democrats are going to figure out that in America, if they would only oppose gun control, a republican would never get elected again. But the democrats will never oppose gun control because they love their children; they don't realize we oppose gun control because we love our children. They are worried a child will die from a stray bullet; we are worried a child will die from a well-aimed bullet.

The democratic opposition to private ownership of weapons is spearheaded by wealthy, high-profile office-holders and celebrities who lie awake at night worrying about some crazy with a gun coming after them and corrupt politicians feeling the guilt of their own sins and worrying about the same. The republican support of private ownership of weapons is spearheaded by wealthy, high-profile office-holders and puppet-masters who lie awake at night rubbing their hands together thinking about staying in office on the votes of unsofisticated pro-gun voters so they can raid the government coffers and manipulate laws and regulations for profit. Send the backwards yuk-yuks a cheap, black mesh ballcap once a year, as one major organization reasons, and you can ride the not-for-profit cash cow on the gun control issue itself.

So on and on we quote the Founding Fathers in here and elsewhere, like Confucious on some golden gun fortune cookie, thinking we will trump some anti-gun argument, or finish the debate with a coup-de-grace of wit and logic, when the reality is we threw the English out and kept their legal system.

I read "regulated" to mean "controlled".

Does anyone have another definition for "regulated"?

Please comment on the meaning of "regulated". Thanks all.

[rwilson452]

In this case regulated implies trained.

Originally Posted by SpeakTrue

I read "regulated" to mean "controlled".

Does anyone have another definition for "regulated"?

Please comment on the meaning of "regulated". Thanks all.

[SpeakTrue]

Accurate, indeed, though I am sorry to hear it..."controlled" would have implied the necessity of civilian armament for somthing other than military skill and therefore something more survivable post-formalization of state national guard structures...

but thank you for and accurate answer...

[NineseveN]

What poll are they talking about?

http://forums.philly.com/n/mb/messag...g=526.1&maxT=9