PSU students seek right to carry weapons

[ithinkimamedic]

Friday, Mar. 07, 2008
PSU students seek right to carry weapons
By Adam Smeltz
- asmeltz@centredaily.com

UNIVERSITY PARK — Nathaniel Sheetz, 23, a Penn State graduate student in industrial engineering, often carries a handgun. And he can: He has a permit to carry a concealed weapon. The moment he steps on campus, however, the permit is no good. Like most other U.S. universities, Penn State prohibits concealed guns on campus, including for those licensed to carry them.

Police receive the sole exception.

But since an outburst of shootings at Virginia Tech and Northern Illinois University, Sheetz and some other Penn Staters are looking to assert their gun-carrying privilege on campus.

“Even an exceptional response time (from police) doesn’t stop a killer” from a massacre, Sheetz said Thursday. “When (police) take minutes to get there — it doesn’t matter to someone who’s willing to commit suicide.

“The only people who would be able to stop something like that would be students, faculty and staff who are on-site, who already are right there and could engage the shooter,” he said.

Plus, Sheetz said, carrying a concealed weapon can enable self-defense. “If you refuse to give people the opportunity to defend themselves, you put a lot of people at risk.”

He and roughly 50 to 100 other Penn State students have loosely aligned themselves with Students for Concealed Carry on Campus. SCCC, a national lobbying group that promotes the cause, has grown to include some 20,000 supporters over the past 10 months.

Its presence here is unofficial. There is no formal student group at the University Park campus, though as many as 20 students participated in a weeklong empty-holster protest in October, Sheetz said.

They wore empty holsters to object to the university ban on concealed handguns. Another protest is planned for late April.

Sheetz also has met with Steve Shelow, the director of university police services.

Shelow said he does not see the advocacy as “necessarily radical or extremist.”

But he does disagree with Sheetz’s arguments. Allowing firearms on campus could launch a string of safety concerns, Shelow said.

They include worries connected to judgment, training, usage, theft and alcohol abuse, he said.

Asked whether more weapons on campus could diminish overall safety, Shelow was frank.

“I’m not sure how to answer that,” he said. “But I just think it’s not where we want to be.”

Bill Mahon, the vice president for university relations, pointed to tragic shootings at non-campus sites, such as shopping malls, where people can conceal handguns.

“Nobody stepped forward and stopped the shooter” in most non-campus circumstances, Mahon said. “ ... We all wish it could happen. It sounds like it would be so awesome to see it happen. But there is not, in fact, a long record of it.”

He called attention to the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. Of 29,569 Americans who died by gunfire in 2004, only 229 were killed in justifiable homicides by private citizens with firearms, according to FBI data on the Brady Web site.

“We don’t believe guns are safe on campus,” Mahon said. He also emphasized that nearly none of the accidental gun violence in the U.S. happens on college campuses. (In 2001, more than 800 people in the U.S. were killed in accidental shootings, according to federal data.)

Sheetz said he and his allies on campus will continue to raise awareness for their cause.

Their goal, he said, is “to educate people that every day in Pennsylvania, thousands of people are carrying guns all over the state, and they’re not doing anything wrong with them.”

http://www.centredaily.com/news/local/story/450912.html

[pex]

He called attention to the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. Of 29,569 Americans who died by gunfire in 2004, only 229 were killed in justifiable homicides by private citizens with firearms, according to FBI data on the Brady Web site.

Not everyone dies, and not everyone carries. What is this guy's problem?

[sluggie24]

Bill Mahon, the vice president for university relations, pointed to tragic shootings at non-campus sites, such as shopping malls, where people can conceal handguns.

“Nobody stepped forward and stopped the shooter” in most non-campus circumstances, Mahon said. “ ... We all wish it could happen. It sounds like it would be so awesome to see it happen. But there is not, in fact, a long record of it.”

Am I mistaken or don't most malls have signs prohibiting firearms?

[ChamberedRound]

He called attention to the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. Of 29,569 Americans who died by gunfire in 2004, only 229 were killed in justifiable homicides by private citizens with firearms, according to FBI data on the Brady Web site.

All this statistic says to me is that there's a whole lot of people who are illegally carrying a weapon, which makes it ALL THE MORE IMPORTANT FOR ME TO LEGALLY CARRY.

Bill Mahon, the vice president for university relations, pointed to tragic shootings at non-campus sites, such as shopping malls, where people can conceal handguns.

“Nobody stepped forward and stopped the shooter” in most non-campus circumstances, Mahon said. “ ... We all wish it could happen. It sounds like it would be so awesome to see it happen. But there is not, in fact, a long record of it.”

So just because most people aren't doing it, we should prevent those that are willing to step up and stop a tragedy from doing what they think is right? That's some contorted, ridiculous, immature, "the cool kids aren't doing it so we shouldn't" logic right there.

Last time I checked, most people that are considered heroes for their actions are, by definition, in the minority. If they weren't, and everyone was willing to step up when the SHTF, they wouldn't be heroes as it would just be considered normal behavior.

[TaePo]

But he does disagree with Sheetz’s arguments. Allowing firearms on campus could launch a string of safety concerns, Shelow said.

They include worries connected to judgment, training, usage, theft and alcohol abuse, he said.

So make a University policy making it an expellable offense for carrying while legally intoxicated etc. This makes more sense than denying everyone the right to self-defense, right?

Asked whether more weapons on campus could diminish overall safety, Shelow was frank.

“I’m not sure how to answer that,” he said. “But I just think it’s not where we want to be.”

Bill Mahon, the vice president for university relations, pointed to tragic shootings at non-campus sites, such as shopping malls, where people can conceal handguns.

“Nobody stepped forward and stopped the shooter” in most non-campus circumstances, Mahon said. “ ... We all wish it could happen. It sounds like it would be so awesome to see it happen. But there is not, in fact, a long record of it.”

Malls mostly are known as no-gun zones so this diminishes the lawful carriers even more so. And as a percentage of the population, the people willing to take the responsibility of carrying firearms is quite small to begin with due to our anti-gun culture that has proliferated.

It is funny that the antigun crowd propounds 'if it only saves ONE child' then saying that not many people successfully defend themselves at least lawfully so maybe those 290 cases could just die instead? Who really are the unfeeling 'killers' here?

[rodder]

Bill Mahon, the vice president for university relations, pointed to tragic shootings at non-campus sites, such as shopping malls, where people can conceal handguns.

“Nobody stepped forward and stopped the shooter” in most non-campus circumstances, Mahon said. “ ... We all wish it could happen. It sounds like it would be so awesome to see it happen. But there is not, in fact, a long record of it.”

what a moron... first of all, the recent mall shootings have taken place in "gun free zones" (lot of good those signs did). Second, two of the most major mass shootings in recent history WERE ended by someone carrying a concealed weapon... the trolley square incident could have ended much much worse than it did, had it not been for an off duty officer carrying his sidearm concealed. The shooting at New Life church was also stopped by a civilian carrying a concealed weapon.

So in every incident where concealed carry was legal and there was a permit holder present, the shooting has been ended before more innocent deaths could occur. On the other hand, in every shooting that has taken place somewhere concealed carry is forbidden (such as the nebraska mall shooting and the VT shooting) the shooter has simply killed as many people as he wanted before finally ending the rampage by his own hand.

So, the lesson to be learned here is obvious: If civilians are allowed to defend themselves with firearms, when incidents like these occur the number of innocent lives lost is lowered. When civilians are prohibited from carrying firearms by so called "gun free zones", mass shootings can and will still happen (duh), and when they do the outcome is much more tragic.

The facts show it plain as day, yet the gun grabbers still insist we will be safer if only the bad guys have guns.

[PAhunter]

Just thought I would add my .02 here.
First, Mr. Shelow and Mr. Mahon are merely spouting the company line. Unless either one of them no longer needs the employment security they have, all you will hear from them is the soft, feel good, pablum coming from the ultra-liberal administration.
Graham Spanier and the Board of Trustees are not willing to relent on this issue for one reason, money. They fear the potential economic impact of an incident on their campus. They are still reeling, I think over the 1996 incident.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hetzel_...lding_shooting)

Until the legislature in Harrisburg takes a position on CC on campus I do not think any college in the Commonwealth will change it's policy.

Jack