becoming a gunsmith/dealer

[idpasharpshooter]

i am interested in becoming a gunsmith/dealer. aside from the paperwork for the atf what else do i need to be in place.

[Gun Bowanna]

A thick skin.

[SteveWag]

Becoming a Dealer is a well-defined path. Fill out the paperwork and satisfy the ATF that you and your place of business meet the requirements. Easy, you either pass or fail.

Becoming a gunsmith is much more vague. Lots of people call themselves gunsmiths. There are no rules for becoming a gunsmith, no licensing no standards. We have a “xxxxxxxx” in Blair County who has butchered many firearms and still has a sign that says “Master Gunsmith” (I had a customer who brought me a Colt 1911 and asked me to destroy the firearm because it had been butchered by this guy). In the end it will be your customers who define your gunsmithing skills.

Now, if you’re asking how to become a “competent” gunsmith, there is no easy answer. We have a gunsmith school in Pittsburgh and AGI has some very good videos (check out E-Bay). A good mechanical background would be nice, a very good upcoming ‘smith in Center County is a truck mechanic, he is very good. Some machinist training is valuable, maybe some high school night classes. Woodworking is not as useful as it used to be.

Look on E-Bay for books by Baker, Howe and Dunlap. Check out VERY seriously the tools they recommend and the techniques they recommend. Once you have a FFL, get hooked up with Brownells and memorize the catalog.

Buy Brownells “Kinks” books.

FWIW check out my site - http://www.gswagner.com/shoptools/shoptoolsindex.html

Steve

[idpasharpshooter]

what are the local/state requirements for a ffl?

[Xringshooter]

Here is some of what you will need:

PA Firearms license (get at the Sheriffs Office)

Any local licenses and/or approvals

PA sales and Use Tax license

A storefront business or approval for a home based business from the local government agencies (the BATFE would prefer a storefront, but will give approval for some home based businesses if the locals give their approval)

Federal Fireams License (and you will need to prove to them that you have or can get the above before they approve/issue the FFL)


Not a true requirement but you're looking for trouble if you don't have them:
Set up a business (either LLC, Corp, or sole proprietorship (however, with this if something goes wrong they can take everything you own)

Business insurance (unless you are independently wealthy and self insure)


Then you have to start filing a PA business tax return (boy is it confusing the first time) and a federal business tax return.

You really need to give it some serious thought before jumping in. I can just about guarantee that you won't make a lot of money unless you grow the business to be very large.

Any other questions you can PM me and I'll try to give you an answer stemming from my experiences (I have a gun repair business).

[WWGunslinger]

what if you just want to be a gunsmith and not a dealer also? Do you need any particular FFLs or other licenses\approvals?

[knight0334]

Originally Posted by WWGunslinger

what if you just want to be a gunsmith and not a dealer also? Do you need any particular FFLs or other licenses\approvals?

Yes. You still need a federal and state license to work on guns as a form of business. Which then you'd still need set up for taxes, probably PICS too.

You will need at minimum a Type 01(dealer) or Type 02(pawn broker) FFL.

[knight0334]

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#i1

[Xringshooter]

As said, you do need a FFL. If a gun is held overnight for repairs it has to be entered into the gunsmiths bound book as an acquisition. The difference is when the original owner comes to pick it up a 4473 does not have to be generated to return it after it is fixed. Also, to fix, customize, build a custom gun, etc., you may have to order parts that are considered a firearm by the BATFE such as the frame of a pistol, a AR lower, or rifle receiver.

The only time a gunsmith doesn't need a license is if they are employed by a shop that has a license.

One other thing, if, as a gunsmith, you buy parts to modify/build into guns and then sell them, you have to have a manufacturers license. From the ATF site:

There are circumstances in which a gunsmith might require a manufacturing license. Generally, a person should obtain a license as a manufacturer of firearms if the person is: 1. performing operations which create firearms or alter firearms (in the case of alterations, the work is not being performed at the request of customers, rather the person who is altering the firearms is purchasing them, making the changes, and then reselling them), 2. is performing the operations as a regular course of business or trade, and 3. is performing the operations for the purpose of sale or distribution of the firearms.

[Kaos]

It's something I've been researching as well. Im still on the fence as I really want to deal in accessories only but it seems to get "in" with some of the distributors...they require an FFL.